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  1. #11
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by mania Click here to enlarge
    I don't see fuel cells becoming the norm. They may have a place aside cars, probably for buses, but as the norm? I hope not. They can be considered inefficient batteries that cannot be charged at the wall - rather need topping up at a station. That require huge amounts of hydrogen, an explosive gas, to be stored in a pressurized (and heavy) container somewhere in the car. That's been the major hold-up point about fuel cells for car companies everywhere. Not to mention that the fuel cell itself is still very expensive, and their efficiency appalling. The amount of energy that initially goes in to turning water in to hydrogen at the station is less then half the amount of energy that goes in to driving your wheels. By comparison, battery powered cars can be above 90% efficient, including all losses in transmitting the power, charging and discharging the batteries, and drivetrain losses. If fuel cells become the norm, it's probably because BP/Shell have had their hand in it, so that they can continue using their existing network of stations.

    And I also dislike photovoltaic solar power Click here to enlarge, just for the sheer inefficiency. The solar panels cost a lot of energy to make, more then they give back in years of service, require a lot of resources, and they take up a lot of room. Give me wind, geothermal or nuclear anyday...
    What a post! Looks like a small book on my phone Click here to enlarge

  2. #12
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by sooty Click here to enlarge
    For old solar panels, the above is all true, but with quantum dot based solar panels it's not, they're easily produced at little energy cost, not to mention substantially more efficient than current panels...
    they'll become common soon enoughClick here to enlarge
    I hadn't heard of these, sound fairly exciting. Click here to enlarge

    If they can get the 40% efficiency they're striving for, the "car-sized solar panel in the desert" plan sounds very plausible. Would be perhaps 15kWh per square meter per day if placed in the desert. Call a "car sized solar panel" 8 square meters and you have 120kWh. With losses, at the Volt's consumption rate, that'd take you 400kms. Quite a bit more then the average daily driving of 50kms or so Click here to enlarge. Bring on quantum dot based solar panels?

  3. #13
    OpelAus Forum Hierarchy Wraith's Avatar
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dieselhead Click here to enlarge
    "Hybrids are like mermaids. When you want a fish, you have a woman. When you want a woman, you have a fish."

    Carlos Ghosn, Renault CEO

    Very interesting stuff indeed. And is coming soon to the East Coast of Oz.

    Just watch this video that explains it all. The only problem is, Adelaide is not in, not yet... Click here to enlarge
    LOL at that silly quote from Carlos Ghosn, but you've still gotta love the guy for giving the automotive World the R35 GT-R Click here to enlarge

    As for advanced electric powered vehicles, I wish they were already here in a big way, it seems they're still in the distant future before becoming mainstream...
    My rides: 2004 Opel/Bertone TS Astra turbo convertible - 2012 Mercedes Benz C204 C Class coupe
    Others: 2009 Honda City VTiL sedan - 2015 Fiat 500
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  4. #14
    VIC Cruise Co-Ordinator sooty's Avatar
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by mania Click here to enlarge
    I hadn't heard of these, sound fairly exciting. Click here to enlarge

    If they can get the 40% efficiency they're striving for, the "car-sized solar panel in the desert" plan sounds very plausible. Would be perhaps 15kWh per square meter per day if placed in the desert. Call a "car sized solar panel" 8 square meters and you have 120kWh. With losses, at the Volt's consumption rate, that'd take you 400kms. Quite a bit more then the average daily driving of 50kms or so Click here to enlarge. Bring on quantum dot based solar panels?
    Just a small article if you're interested about them
    http://www.i-sis.org.uk/QDAUESC.php
    ...i should get to make and tune some next year Click here to enlarge
    Do i think it'll be used in the automotive industry though? No...probably not, but at least it's an alternate electricity source, which reduces the demand on fossil fuels, buying us some time to find viable alternatives...
    2007 Liberty STi
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  5. #15
    QLD Cruise Co-ordinator glider's Avatar
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by sooty Click here to enlarge
    Just a small article if you're interested about them
    http://www.i-sis.org.uk/QDAUESC.php
    ...i should get to make and tune some next year Click here to enlarge
    Do i think it'll be used in the automotive industry though? No...probably not, but at least it's an alternate electricity source, which reduces the demand on fossil fuels, buying us some time to find viable alternatives...
    the power supply from downed ufos Click here to enlarge heh like they'll ever get that tech out of the hands of the us military
    Glider aka Toby, 94 Calibra Turbo
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  6. #16
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    Hmm, a bit of a shame, their figures are about half the 40% I got from wikipedia. Here's an even better use of solar panels, allowing up to 1MW from a single panel by 2012, estimated. Click here to enlarge

  7. #17
    VIC Cruise Co-Ordinator sooty's Avatar
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by mania Click here to enlarge
    Hmm, a bit of a shame, their figures are about half the 40% I got from wikipedia.
    Current figures? yeah, they only average about 25%....but the quantum dot based panels are capable of 65% efficiency.
    2007 Liberty STi
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  8. #18
    OpelAus Lurker gmonkey's Avatar
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    this was the salt water powered car i was on about.. but due to GM being bankrupt company its canned pretty sure.. its the GM highwire

    http://www.freshcreation.com/entry/g...of_the_future/

  9. #19
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    That's a volt where the generator's been replaced by a fuel cell I believe Click here to enlarge. There's also a diesel option. Fuel cells don't run directly on sea water, but they can run on sea water that's had a lot of energy put in to it, cracking it in to hydrogen and oxygen. Top Gear does like to talk up fuel cells as if they run directly on water, with no additional energy required... which is of course impossible.

  10. #20
    OpelAus Enthusiast dieselhead's Avatar
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    Guys, could you please keep the discussion to electric cars and more importantly, to this idea of charging & battery replacing network?

    I would like to know, do you see yourselves buying an electric car in 2012? This idea of purchasing the car without batteries and therefore making the car affordable, cheaper than a conventional petrol/diesel one, is amazing! You would buy the car and sign for a plan, just like the one you've got for your iPhone. The more you drive, the more you pay. However, at an estimated starting price of 6 cents/km, or $6/100 km, you'd be better off being electric. As more and more cars get on the road, the infrastructure becomes cheaper to run and you could have the price going to 3 cents/km in a few years!
    Renault SPORT Clio RS 200 Cup Trophee





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