Diesel>Petrol

[entice]

you're spot on.

If the car is for personal commute, elise is just fine. If I need to carry extra's, it's a different story..

The commo I like, but it's just.. so Big..

I've always had nimble cars, ut I must say that driving teh 6.0L brought a smile to my face....

The astra.. well the only bit I dont like is the MFD.. it's not quite up to par with teh CDX, and that's way behind the euro bretheren.. but that can be arranged .. quitre easily....

oh, the sri 2.2 is now avail in aus...

[Vectracious]

Why is everyone having a go at entice for putting a rational argument up against a diesel? So far, he's the only one that has actually made multiple points against diesel - however I don't need to hear 8 diesel fans keep saying "Torque" a million times - yes diesels are economical and more efficient in terms of converting dinosaur bones to power than petrol engines, but they still sound like crap and you need to wear a glove to fill them up - when you find a servo that the pump's nozzle fits into your car.... and you pay equal or more to petrol for a less refined product......

Having 400Nm in an Astra or 120i?? Big deal - doesnt mean that it can tow a horsefloat or a twin axle trailer....

[dieselhead]

entice, don't think i ever said you 're bagging the Astra sorry if it looked like i did
i can't say i'm a diehard diesel fan. sure, i love my car. that's because it puts a smile on my face every time i get behind the wheel. i agree the CDTi is pretty low spec. would have loved some leather and sport seats, satnav maybe... i had an Astra CDX wagon before this and i miss the better BC and the better sounding stereo... but at the end of the day, for me, the car is mainly about the engine, handling and brakes. all of them better in the CDTi.
VW Golf could be a diesel option, but the conservative style, serious extra $$$ and the less vigurous engine (in my view) are issues can't go past... i also have a problem with the arrogance of the local VW dealer. otherwise, there's not much to chose from in this league, is it?

now, about fuel: done 4,600km and used 300 litres. figures read on odo and fuel bills, not on the BC. that's an average of 6.52 l/100km. never had problems at the bowser and never got my hands too dirty either-seems that stations are improving with the increasing number of oil burners. diesel purchased at 118-119 c/litre. and believe you me, i never drive for economy and never left the Metro area. performance AND economy? all i can say is QED.

[digifish]

and one more thing: could people that haven't driven yet a modern turbodiesel just stop talking about how superior petrol engines are?

I was thinking about that. The torque from the turbo-diesel and the torque from the turbo-petrol happen at very different points in the rev-range and come on in a different way, there is no comparison to how they feel.

I was driving up into the Adelaide hills yesterday (steep drive up to windy-point for people who know it) and I was amazed at how effortless the Astra CDTi did it. I could not feel the hill through the accelerator, it was like I was on the flat. It's an amazing feeling.

The torque curve for the CDTi is a much nicer, relaxed and satisfyingly meaty wave to ride than that from the SRi (not driven a VRX).

digifish

[entice]

UH HUH...

But that all depends on your style of driving

it seems "effortless" in a diesel as your cruising in it's torque/power band....

it also would be "effortless" for a ptrol engined car if you were in it's powerband.

But I still maintain.. having driven petrols N/a and FI modern and old, and diesels, modern and old (aint it grand you dont need to "glow" it anymore?), that when the going gets tough and things are happening fast and your in twisty bits etc etc (lets call it, extreme spirited driving), I'd still suggest that the Petrol engined car be more practical in that application..

as I said, it all depends on your application and style of driving

[Wraith]

I'm not trying to change your mind....I'm trying to convince you to cut down on your greenhouse gas emitions by sporting around in a diesel....:P

Is this indeed the case ??

I thought diesels emissions were way greater/dirtier than petrol engines ??

I agree with you guys as you've all stated regarding petrol vs diesel, it's a personal choice, as I've stated I'm not a fan of the oilers, I particularly hate the black plume you constantly have following you around with spirited driving in a diesel and like I've stated before elsewhere, you'll probably cop a nature freak dobbing you into the EPA - when chances are you've got a diesel to help the enviroment as stated above LOL, but like Entice, I may one day have one - but only as an everyday run-a-bout, due to it's frugal nature, nothing else...

For all my hi-po wants, I'll stick to forced induction petrol engines, I don't think diesels will ever be able to match the kw capability of petrol engines and the petrol engines can always match or beat the nm output of the diesels, especially now that direct injection is becoming more common

The new BMW 335ci twin turbo petrol 3.0ltr inline six, produces it's peak torque of 400nm at just 1,200rpm !!!

[rjastra]

Didn't Topgear do a comparison of a top spec diesel BMW 5 series diesel versus an equivalently priced petrol version?

The petrol one blitzed it round the test circuit. The diesel had just too small a rev range and not enough KWs.

[digifish]

Didn't Topgear do a comparison of a top spec diesel BMW 5 series diesel versus an equivalently priced petrol version?

The petrol one blitzed it round the test circuit. The diesel had just too small a rev range and not enough KWs.

Clarkson hates diesels, so what do you expect

Fith gear did the Astra VRX aginst the 888 CDTi...the result after a lap of the track was less than a second in favour of the VRX.

digifish

[dieselhead]

well, the same Clarkson was slower driving a diesel Jag at Nurbungring than a German chick in a Ford van! sure he hates diesels, or he just can't drive, one ot the two. do i need to say more?

[Wraith]

Clarkson hates diesels, so what do you expect

Fith gear did the Astra VRX aginst the 888 CDTi...the result after a lap of the track was less than a second in favour of the VRX.

digifish

This is true, BUT the 888 CDTi is tuned up and the VXR was stock and it still beat the oiler !

Give a similar tune to the VXR and the 888 will be a smudge in the rear view !

Also on that same show, did you notice the black plume I've refered to in my other post ??

That's one thing that really puts me off the oilers....