Focus XR5, makes you think twice when buying an astra VXR

[Poogene2001]

Just read the Ford Focus XR5 review in this month's Wheels magazine. As everyone has been saying, the wheels team found it to be a great handler and capable when compared to an XR6 turbo and a WRX. Not as quick in a straight line as either of the above (or the VXR) but a well built and polished fun machine. I dont think that $36990 is a bargain for a compact hatchback, but when compared to mid $40K's for a VXR it seems to be money well spent.
Also the lack of an Auto option puts a smile on my face. Learn to drive a car properly you automatic hippies!
If my Astra CDX suddenly increased in value to $36990, id definitely trader her in for a bright orange XR5.

[Vampire]

quite a dilemma indeed

[MatsHolden]

Also the lack of an Auto option puts a smile on my face. Learn to drive a car properly you automatic hippies!
If my Astra CDX suddenly increased in value to $36990, id definitely trader her in for a bright orange XR5.

Both the VXR and SRi Turbo come in manual only too, the way it shoul be. If you were going to buy an Orange XR5, add another $1800 and if you want the leather/heated seats it's something like another $2000 option. So when you start speccing it up to what the VXR and even the SRi Turbo come with standard then your XR5 will be getting into at least the 40k mark. Doesn't matter what they say about the XR5, i'm a Holden/GM man so VXR or SRi Turbo would be on my list. Just comes down to where your brand loyalty sits.

[R3N]

that and the fact i was told all the cars that are coming here (perth) are all pre-ordered. which makes me think, why are people buying a car they haven't test drove?

[SSS_Hoon]

apparently the xr5 has really bad torque steer.

a golf gti member test drove both and found that the DSG GTi to be the better car and was worth the xtra cash.


as for auto hippies once you drive a dsg car you will not look back at a manual again.

in the future all cars will be dsg or similar.

and the focus is very limited on options that come standard on most cars like cruise control.

SSS_Hoon

[Poogene2001]

Im not here to defend the focus.
I already own an astra so lets not get into "brand loyalty". I will always buy the best car I can. One that fills my needs and impresses me in terms of quality and performance will always be the one I choose, regardless of the badge that is stuck onto the front.
All im saying is that if leather seats and cruise control are not important factors for you (and for me they certainly are not) then an XR5 makes alot of sense. As far as torque steer is concerned, any car putting out over 150kw thru the front wheels would have trouble getting it to the ground. This forum's beloved VXR has been criticised for exactly the same thing.
Finally, its a bit rich comparing it to a golf Gti considering the price difference. For a DSG transmissioned Gti you could pay upto $48000, plus the months and months of waiting associated with the high demand for the car. That makes it almost 25% more expensive and as far as I can see, not quite in the same league.
The point is this: If your happy to have cloth seats, change the gears yourself, and keep an eye on the speedo instead of allowing electrics to control your velocity (oh and drive a car with a blue oval on the nose) then the XR5 is going to be hard to beat.

[GreyRex]

Exactly...

[Red AH SRI T]

VXR will be low 40's not Mid 40's :p

[MatsHolden]

Im not here to defend the focus.
I already own an astra so lets not get into "brand loyalty".

Reason I mentioned brand loyalty is because the VXR and XR5 are pretty evenly matched cars, so comes down to whether you prefer Holden or Ford.

[180HOA]

apparently the xr5 has really bad torque steer.

a golf gti member test drove both and found that the DSG GTi to be the better car and was worth the xtra cash.


as for auto hippies once you drive a dsg car you will not look back at a manual again.

in the future all cars will be dsg or similar.

and the focus is very limited on options that come standard on most cars like cruise control.

SSS_Hoon

I'd be surprised to see a FWD with a lot of power that didn't suffer from torque steer - and I'd expect the XR5 to suffer more than the Golf because it's packing a reasonable amount more power, and is reportedly quicker.

Personally, I'd go the XR5 over the GTi - quicker car, less cash, and looks better to my eyes.

As for the DSG, it's a great thing (when the car's rolling), and is a major improvement over conventional autos, but I still wouldn't buy one because it's very vague at takeoff, and you're still not in full control of the transmission (the 'tiptronic' function will override your selected gear if it decides you're stupid, for example). The DSG is a gem, but I can't see it replacing the old fashioned manual for a while yet.

[SSS_Hoon]

i wasnt being brand loyal towards the golf yeah we all know that we own one, i was just stating someone else findings that had driven both is all, i too am from a ford family and the focus is in the right price range if i was looking for a new car also.

i wasnt comparing XR5 to a GTi he was i was just sharing his findings is all.

as for 48k yeah that is possible i guess we were lucky got ours cheap and no wait hehehe gotta love cancelled orders.

as for the XR5 being a qwiker car i dont know will have to wait and see about that, the guy that i was talking about said the DSG GTi seemed qwiker.

i think that the XR5 will give the VXR more of a run in sales wise as will the mazda compared to the golf as the ppl that buy the golf dont buy it for its performance which it has, they buy it for the build quality of a very well recgonised brand and they know they are getting a quality car, and the ppl that buy the XR5, VXR and the mazda are ppl as you say dont mind compromising on the litle things that make a quality car as they dont need them or want them so they dont want to pay the xtra price to have them if they dont want them.

all in all its totally up to the individuals choice and i dont want to turn this thread into another gti v vxr v everything else thread.

SSS_Hoon

[MatsHolden]

...dont mind compromising on the litle things that make a quality car as they dont need them or want them so they dont want to pay the xtra price to have them if they dont want them.


lol I think i get what you're trying to say. hehe:D

[Poogene2001]

what it boils down to is that all the mentioned cars are capable and attractive in their individual ways. Given the choice (for free) i wouldnt chose the XR5. but it i had to pay for it, and lets face it, most of us do have to pay for our cars, then I would find it hard to go past.... despite the fact that the plastics are cheap, the seats arent leather, its a ford, it suffers torque steer, it doesnt have cruise control and its an old fashioned manual. But hey, thats just me! :p

[aussie_in_london]

the Focus ST/XR5 is known to have a drinking problem much more so than the VXR : ))))))
you guys will be getting large 4 pot AP brakes with huge slotted and vented disks, 19" wheels and part leather recaros as standard on the VXR so you will see why the price is above the XR5 which will come with 18"s, a smaller 2 pot brake system and material recaros in standard form.

[xplosv57]

Spoke to a guy who works for Ford today, he had an XR5 come in after 100 kays and the gearbox was stuffed. Opened up the gearbox sump plug to find ..... no oil!!!!!

Good old Ford quality LOL!!!!!!!

I think ill stick with the VXR over the XR5!!!

(suprised it ran for 100 kays without gearbox oil though??!!)

[MatsHolden]

Spoke to a guy who works for Ford today, he had an XR5 come in after 100 kays and the gearbox was stuffed. Opened up the gearbox sump plug to find ..... no oil!!!!!

Good old Ford quality LOL!!!!!!!

I think ill stick with the VXR over the XR5!!!

(suprised it ran for 100 kays without gearbox oil though??!!)

That is almost too hard to believe! That is just unforgivable.

[Mrs T]

i wasnt being brand loyal towards the golf yeah we all know that we own one, i was just stating someone else findings that had driven both is all, i too am from a ford family and the focus is in the right price range if i was looking for a new car also.

i wasnt comparing XR5 to a GTi he was i was just sharing his findings is all.

as for 48k yeah that is possible i guess we were lucky got ours cheap and no wait hehehe gotta love cancelled orders.

as for the XR5 being a qwiker car i dont know will have to wait and see about that, the guy that i was talking about said the DSG GTi seemed qwiker.

i think that the XR5 will give the VXR more of a run in sales wise as will the mazda compared to the golf as the ppl that buy the golf dont buy it for its performance which it has, they buy it for the build quality of a very well recgonised brand and they know they are getting a quality car, and the ppl that buy the XR5, VXR and the mazda are ppl as you say dont mind compromising on the litle things that make a quality car as they dont need them or want them so they dont want to pay the xtra price to have them if they dont want them.

all in all its totally up to the individuals choice and i dont want to turn this thread into another gti v vxr v everything else thread.

SSS_Hoon

I understand what you are getting at Damian although i would like to slightly disagree with you on one small point.

When you talk of build quality for the Golf, i would like to point out the the VXR is a european built car as well and in no way compares with Ford and Mazda.

Anyone that has driven a Japanese car and gets into a Golf or an Astra (or old model corsa) will be able to tell the difference by just cloing the doors.

As everyone here knows, i had my hand up from the beginning for a VXR now that probably isnt possible now and i had considered the XR5 due to the extra doors. Now i never imagined that i would ever contemplate buying a Ford but i agree that you need to buy according to your needs.

This doesnt need to be a Golf vs VXR vs everything else thread, it is good for people to hear the faults of these cars without anyone being too bias.

The XR5 lost me when i found out there was no cruise control....... what the???? That shouldnt be an option these days....

Anyway sorry if i offended anyone

[beep beep sri]

first time ive read this thread and one thing caught my Eye. 3 door v 5 door. ive seen an xr5 at frankston ford and must say i did'nt even notice it was a 5 door. after having my sri for 4 years i must say i would never buy another 3 door again. that must also be considerd in the pricing stakes when comparing 5 doors usualy cost more.

[MatsHolden]

that must also be considerd in the pricing stakes when comparing 5 doors usualy cost more.

The Monaro had 2 less doors than the sedan and it cost more. :p But you did say usually.

[Miyagi]

Good to see most people are pretty level headed in these parts o the world. :cool:

IT's a FWD so of course there is room for torque steer although the XR5 really does handle like a weapon, they seem to have found a very good mix by mating the Duratec engine with the focus chassis.

The fact is both cars are awesome.

The ST / XR5T is reknowned as a lovely refined package with good urge and a nice engine note whilst the VXR is known as the slightly faster, wilder and more engaging of the two.. more of a pure drivers car.

I just hope the VXR doesn't suffer the supply issues that the Golf GTI and now the XR5T (it's getting bad) have in Australia. If HSV can bring them over in decent numbers they may win the sales war purely on having stock available as i'm sure the VXR would sell itself to any person who wants a great car.

[Shaun]

I think the same issue is going happen with the VXR as with the Golf and XR5T. Limited stock will be coming to australia and the VXR is still in very much High Demand in the UK and Europe.

[astro boy]

I had a quick quiz and the Wheels XR5 vs XR6 turbo vs WRX. Haven't read the article yet but the 0-100 time of the XR5 they recorded was 7.6. But they also only managed 6.6 for the wrx.

[Poogene2001]

I had a quick quiz and the Wheels XR5 vs XR6 turbo vs WRX. Haven't read the article yet but the 0-100 time of the XR5 they recorded was 7.6. But they also only managed 6.6 for the wrx.

How many times a day do you test your 0-100km/h sprint times? Unless your talking about the track, or the drag strip, then the 0-100 times mean very little in the real world. Bearing in mind that its FWD (vs. AWD and RWD for the cars it was compared to in the wheels test) its not a bad result for a 5 door hatchback. If you do read the article you will find the author goes on to say that in the real world (where they are more factors to a cars performance than standing 0-100 times) the XR5 nips at the heels of the WRX in the twisty bits and is far more nimble than the rolley polley XR6Turbo (not to mention well cheaper than both of them). I imagine that if u threw a Golf Gti with DSG onto the same course it would be marginally quicker than the Ford (but you'd need to pay a 10K premium, and yes... wait months and months before you could actually have it!)
If I found $10,000 today, i'd instantly trade my squeeky seated (0-100 in 10.5 seconds) Astra CDX for an XR5 (even with no cruise control <oh my god, in todays society? not even as an option? oh my god> )

[SSS_Hoon]

yeah they tested the XR5 at 15.5 1/4 mile and the golf gti manual at 15.4 and the dsg is qwiker then the manual hehehehe.

and if you were to drive the dsg gti round the track it would be faster and a better ride too, from what i have been reading.

but its wheels and they dont know how too drive fwd cars and they only show aussie cars in there reviews, they should of reviewd the xr5 against the gti mps and the vxr at the end of the year when they are here.


but what has already been stated the wait for tht gti is so long but its getting better was talking to someone who ordered it end of march and picks it up in a week so not even 3 months turn around so its getting shorter(unless you want dsg that is)

i can see the vxr being the same wait times..


SSS_Hoon

[Miyagi]

we've had one member already run the quarter over on the xr5t site (video footage available if u want to go check it out) and he got it down to a 15.1 sec over the 1/4. Once the car has opened up a little bit more and if he can get a perfect run he'll go a high 14 in stock form... not bad :)

I believe Wheels are going to the do a proper hot hatch shootout at the end of the year, Motor will too. They've only done a comparo now to ride the current buzz on the car.

It'd be great if they did a XR5T, VXR, 3 MPS and Golf GTI review at the end of the year!

[SSS_Hoon]

15.1 that is not bad at all it should do high 14's for sure.

i think that is similar to what MR T did when his was sorta stock wasn't it?

i so want to get MZ_GTi to let me or even her take her GTi to WSID but it wont happen so sad hehehehe.

and MRS T i know what your saying about build quality hey i drive a Jap SSS and getting from that into the GTI is like another world completly.

i read in that wheels article that the VXR is due november and august for the mazda.

so hopefully at the end of the year they can do a review on all the current hot hatches availbale in Aus, i would also like the new renault clio 197 in there too.


SSS_Hoon

[rusole21]

hahaha. 15.1 is crap. standard srit do 14.6-15.0. and no cruise? wat a joke

[Miyagi]

hahaha. 15.1 is crap. standard srit do 14.6-15.0. and no cruise? wat a joke

:rolleyes: The XR5T isn't about straight line speed, it's about available rolling speed and more importantly corner to corner performance.

[imay]

What's with this "brand loyalty" crap?

Surely it comes down to what you like the look of, what has the bells'n'whistles you want, what goes how you want it to go, what's got the safety features you might need but never want to use, and most importantly, what your back pocket can cope with!
Don't get me wrong . . . I have 2 Astras: CD hatch and a convertible. Both are great cars. But that doesn't mean my next car is automatically going to be an Astra, or some other offering from GM.
Open your eyes guys! There's heaps of nice stuff heading our way. Nice offerings from most Euro makers . . . and the Asian manufacturers have finally got their quality control/designs sorted (well, some of 'em) and are producing nice cars too (Honda, Mazda, Lexus).
Don't forget: your Astra/Barina/Vectra is only a Daewoo equivalent in Germany!

I follow V8 Supercars because I like the sport. No one can tell me there is any "street cred" difference between the 2 makes. Open it up to include the likes of Mitsubishi, Toyota and any other maker that wants to join, I say. Make the car's performance comparable (like the real ones you buy) and leave the rest up to the teams and drivers.

Getting back on track . . . I reckon the XR5 is a nice package. I'd seriously consider it. Just can't find the button to lower the roof!

[rusole21]

yeah that is a good point.
has anyone read that small thing in the motor mag a few months back about the pug 209 cup racer? it has a naturally aspirated 2l with 209kw. now that would be a car i would buy over all these others. that is incredible power seeing as though holden strugled to make 185kw out of a 5litre a few years back.

[one2have]

Am I on the wrong forum? I thought maybe I stumbled on crapfords.com

The XR5 does not excite me in the slightest. how can you compare this budget car (without the budget pricetag) to a GTI or the gorgeous VXR??

I had a hired Focus in Adelaide and I wanted to kick it in the nuts when I handed it back - but guess what.. It didn't have any!!! I know it was a stocker, but the XR5 wasn't built from scratch..

And yes I'm grumpy..

[180HOA]

I think the XR5 is different enough to not be able to judge it based on driving a base model...

[one2have]

I think the XR5 is different enough to not be able to judge it based on driving a base model...

That aside.

Wouldn't you rather fork out some extra dollars for the GTI?

[nadg63]

Not until VW decide to release the 3-door down here, (same thing with the Ford). I'm not a 'family' person so why do I want the extra doors/weight - the Astra has the race won in my mind.

[Red AH SRI T]

Not until VW decide to release the 3-door down here, (same thing with the Ford). I'm not a 'family' person so why do I want the extra doors/weight - the Astra has the race won in my mind.



smart boi ;)

[Charlatan]

Not until VW decide to release the 3-door down here, (same thing with the Ford). I'm not a 'family' person so why do I want the extra doors/weight - the Astra has the race won in my mind.

Pretty mindless way to judge a car. VRX over an RS4 for you?

Personally, I havent driven either a VRX or a XR5, but I'd drive both before I bought.

[nadg63]

No I wouldn't, for that money I'd be looking M3! (don't like Audi's anyway).

[MatsHolden]

Pretty mindless way to judge a car. VRX over an RS4 for you?

Personally, I havent driven either a VRX or a XR5, but I'd drive both before I bought.

VXR mate. VRX is a Magna lol.

[one2have]

What does an RS4 have to do with anything?? A hot hatch looks better as a two door (yes even the GTI)..

http://img.drive.com.au/drive_images/Editorial/2005/10/13/13hotHa_leadimage__400x234.jpg

VS
http://www.hsv.com.au/news/2005/images/vxr2.jpg

Or even a VRX for the Dyslexics.. lol

http://www.autoclub.com.au/uploaded_images/mitsubishi-380-vrx-792653.jpg

[Poogene2001]

Wouldn't you rather fork out some extra dollars for the GTI?

How far can we stretch that quote?
Wouldn't you rather fork out the extra money for a mitsubish evo 8/9? thats quick and has four doors...
Wouldn't you rather fork out the extra money for a mercedes cls55 Amg or Ferrari F430? those are really quick and have cruise control...
Wouldn't you rather...?

[SSS_Hoon]

the 3 door GTI should be here november hopefully....
and they are only 75kg lighter then the 4 door, but i agree they look better in 3 door form.

how heavy is the VXR anyway anyone know?

i dont think you can compare the base model focus to the XR5, just like you cannot compare the base model 3 door astra to the VXR now can you?


and you dont like audi's are you crazieeeee man hehehehe.


SSS_Hoon

[blueraven]

my dad has an Audi 2005 s8 :(


and he wont let me drive it...


i hate him sometimes :(

[nadg63]

and you dont like audi's are you crazieeeee man hehehehe.

It was me that doesn't like Audi's - just look boring!

When I last looked an RS4 was about $160,000 - no way!

I'd rather spend $75,000 on an R34GTR plus another $5,000 on an exhaust and Apexi ECU plus air intake kit for 300kws ATW - just like a mate of mine has just done! (aren't there times when 'friends' really manage to piss you off ......... !!)

[one2have]

How far can we stretch that quote?
Wouldn't you rather fork out the extra money for a mitsubish evo 8/9? thats quick and has four doors...
Wouldn't you rather fork out the extra money for a mercedes cls55 Amg or Ferrari F430? those are really quick and have cruise control...
Wouldn't you rather...?

An extra $4K for a GTI on top of the XR5 is not too far a stretch. Unless you have very short arms.. We're still talking sub-$40K

I probably shouldn't compare the XR5 to the stocker - but I generally hate all FORDs (from the EA onwards) so I have an extremly biased view.

Poogene - I know what your next car is gonna be.

[one2have]

And for the Audi guys.. Check out this RS6 I spotted the other day:

http://www.opelaus.com/forum/showthread.php?t=8741

[jimeegee]

I'd take the Mazda 3 MPS when it arrives :)

[Charlatan]

yeah VXR ... whatever.

So many experts with a wheels magazine subscription, and blind brand loyalty. We marketers love you!

Anyone driven a 225 Cup? Now that is a slick hothatch

[Dee]

wait until the mazda 3 MPS is realeased towards the end of the year and make a decision then. i heard last night the mazda will be putting out 175(ish)KW at the front wheels...


then there will be more confusion due to more cars.

[MatsHolden]

It puts out 190kw, whatever that is at the wheels I dunno. MPS looks too tame, doesn't look a lot different to a standard Mazda 6. Also it isn't a hatch as such and is priced from $48,600.

[Poogene2001]

Poogene - I know what your next car is gonna be.

HA! I wish

Although I just got a job at LeasePlan (australias biggest car leaser) so... maybe, just maybe, I could sacrifice some pay and have a volvo sourced 2.5T under my bonnet.

[one2have]

yeah VXR ... whatever.

So many experts with a wheels magazine subscription, and blind brand loyalty. We marketers love you!

Anyone driven a 225 Cup? Now that is a slick hothatch

Hey!!!! I have a MOTOR mag subscription ok!!!! ha ha.

I drove a 2year old Clio sport a couple of weeks ago. Man that was fun! Handled pretty well too. 225 Cup hmmmm.. didn't think of that.

[Charlatan]

225 Cup hmmmm.. didn't think of that.

You're not the only one! The most overlooked performance car of the decade.

[one2have]

You're not the only one! The most overlooked performance car of the decade.

Except the rear end on the Megane is a BADONKADONK!!

[SSS_Hoon]

It puts out 190kw, whatever that is at the wheels I dunno. MPS looks too tame, doesn't look a lot different to a standard Mazda 6. Also it isn't a hatch as such and is priced from $48,600.


i think he is talking about the mazda3 mps not the mazda6 mps awd car.


SSS_Hoon

[Charlatan]

VXR drivers are the only ones who'll see the back though ;)

ps - acquired taste, took me a while, but I cant look away now

[MatsHolden]

i think he is talking about the mazda3 mps not the mazda6 mps awd car.


SSS_Hoon

Nah I was talking about the Mazda6 MPS AWD but forgot about the Mazda 3 MPS. The 3 MPS definately looks better than the 6 MPS, but still not as aggressive as the VXR.

[180HOA]

That aside.

Wouldn't you rather fork out some extra dollars for the GTI?

Nope. The GTi is a nice car, but I'd take the extra power and speed of the XR5, and its looks, over the Golf. Plus, I could cope without leather in the XR5, but not in the Golf - not a fan of tartan...

[one2have]

Nope. The GTi is a nice car, but I'd take the extra power and speed of the XR5, and its looks, over the Golf. Plus, I could cope without leather in the XR5, but not in the Golf - not a fan of tartan...

The tartan sux i know. But the two door GTI (when we get it) is a lot sexier. And doesn't have the dreaded blue oval badge.

Did you know that FORD is an acronym for Fix Or Repair Daily..

haha.

[aussie_in_london]

VXR drivers are the only ones who'll see the back though ;)

ps - acquired taste, took me a while, but I cant look away now

that i know for sure isnt the case lmfao

and on looks of the megane we have a 5 door td which is the wifes work car and its ugly as f*ck lol

[Charlatan]

that i know for sure isnt the case lmfao

and on looks of the megane we have a 5 door td which is the wifes work car and its ugly as f*ck lol

post cognitive dissonance

lmfao

[Red AH SRI T]

You're not the only one! The most overlooked performance car of the decade.


I used to sell Renaults, they are one HOT hot hatch!!!

And i love the look of the megane!!

[one2have]

I used to sell Renaults, they are one HOT hot hatch!!!

And i love the look of the megane!!

the clio sport is awesome. But like I said before, the Megane has a Badonkadonk.

[Red AH SRI T]

yeah, i agree, the RSC is a much more pure car, better handler, throw around car than the RSM

[Poogene2001]

Nope. The GTi is a nice car, but I'd take the extra power and speed of the XR5, and its looks, over the Golf. Plus, I could cope without leather in the XR5, but not in the Golf - not a fan of tartan...

Spot on old chap, spot on!


post cognitive dissonance

Someone is gonna fail marketing! i think its officially known as Post Purchase Cognitive Dissonance!

[SSS_Hoon]

anyone goto the dutton rally at WSID on the weekend?

a few ppl i know went and got some times from WSID for the Golf GTI stock and also the Focus XR5

there were 3 GTI's only know what 2 ran the best was a 14.7 but 14.8 14.9 were the averages

and the best for the XR5 was 15.13 and avg around the 15.2 mark...all were stock hehehehehe.

i like the sound of that go the GTI..:lol: (non biased coments too)


but it could also be put down to drivers too as i think the drivers of the focus were first timers as were a few of the gti drivers(at drag racing that is) and the focus were females(not that means anything ok MRS_T)


SSS_Hoon

[blackSRi]

The XR5 is a nice package, pity there's such a waiting list and so few coming to Oz, (see http://carsguide.news.com.au/story/0,20384,19242123-21822,00.html ) too hard to get in Perth, so some of us don't want to wait and we pick other turbo beasts with Brembo brakes and Recaro seats ;) lol.

[one2have]

The XR5 is a nice package, pity there's such a waiting list and so few coming to Oz, (see http://carsguide.news.com.au/story/0,20384,19242123-21822,00.html ) too hard to get in Perth, so some of us don't want to wait and we pick other turbo beasts with Brembo brakes and Recaro seats ;) lol.

Hey don't worry guys, there are plenty of XR2's around still. Ha ha...

http://img.drive.com.au/drive_images/dealer/bridunfor/22087_1_m.jpg

[blueraven]

Hey don't worry guys, there are plenty of XR2's around still. Ha ha...

http://img.drive.com.au/drive_images/dealer/bridunfor/22087_1_m.jpg


thats just not funny man...not funny...



:D
(personally i cant wait for the MPS..)

[jimeegee]

They compared the new SRi turbo and XR5 on the car show yesterday...useless comparison...apparently it comes down to whether your parents drive Holdens or Fords...well I guess that explains why I bought an Astra then as my mum drives an N13 Pulsar :P

I still prefer my TS over the AH anyday...

[SSS_Hoon]

They compared the new SRi turbo and XR5 on the car show yesterday...useless comparison...apparently it comes down to whether your parents drive Holdens or Fords...well I guess that explains why I bought an Astra then as my mum drives an N13 Pulsar :P

I still prefer my TS over the AH anyday...


from what i have read its a fair comparason as the focus is slow......

but looks better inside...

SSS_Hoon

[jimeegee]

Sure its a fair comparison, but there is no point comparing something and coming to a useless conclusion eg. read above.

But yeah I like most four cylinder turbos anyway, by year's end, it will become a very tough decision if you're in the market for a hot hatch!

[Poogene2001]

But yeah I like most four cylinder turbos anyway, by year's end, it will become a very tough decision if you're in the market for a hot hatch!

So does that mean you dont like the Focus xr5? Its in no way a 4 cylinder turbo.

And as far as the Focus being slow... not compared to the astra sri... 6.8 isnt a horrible time 0-100, but thats not at all the cars strength. From what all the reviews say, its the handling and adjustability of the car that makes it a worthy oponent to a GTi and similar!

[MatsHolden]

Some reviews have said the handling may be too 'tame', not giving a truely engaging drive on the XR5. And yeh it's a 5 cylinder, hence the XR5 model designation, not XR4.

[Tommi]

Well its a year on and what do you all think now???

Ford XR5
HSV VXR
VW GTI

And let me thought some new guys in..

RX8
WRX

-----

I just had a read of all 5 pages of threads, good read considering I'm looking to buy a new car and I didn't even know that a VXR existed until yesterday when the sales guy in the back of the new SRI I was test driving was mumbling things about V's and X's and more power ... something about bigger wheels, bigger turbo, ..... still I couldn't turn off any driver aids :(

The new SRI is a nice car though.. my friend owns a 2000 Audi S4 that is chip and tweaked and I'm looking to buy a new car with luxary, performance and to give him a run for his money... any ideas?

[OZChris]

We went through a similar dilemma earlier this year when 'upgrading' my wife's Cooper S; we looked at VXR, XR5, Golf GTi, and 3 MPS. It was an interesting exercise as things that we had not considered knocked options out.

Elimination notes:
- XR5: the boot size was not much bigger than the Cooper S - which was one of the reasons for upgrading; price you pay for the dual exhaust I guess :p
- Golf GTi: looks too much like any other Golf :eek:
- VXR and 3 MPS: great power but would be lethal in the wet :D

We ended up with a 6 MPS; bigger but the AWD and 190 kw puts big :D on the driver's face. Plus the added room helps with little ones :). The 6 MPS handles very well too.

Apologies for the long reply on the Opel forum, just thought that I'd share ;)

[VZKOOP]

my friend owns a 2000 Audi S4 that is chip and tweaked and I'm looking to buy a new car with luxary, performance and to give him a run for his money... any ideas?

Twin Turbo V6 with approx 190KW standard - Let's say he's managed to squeeze another 40 out of it with a chip and "tweaks"......

The only thing that you'll buy standard that isn't an 8 or worth 100K plus is probably a STi or EVO (You'd hardly call an EVO luxury though). Otherwise go buy a VZ SS or Calais get a catback, OTRCAI & Mafless Edit. You'll have about 235KW at the tyres, you'll have change out of $40K and your mate won't know which way you went. He'll still be driving an Audi so he probably won't care........

[Tommi]

no need for apologies :)
I haven't considered the 6 MPS, I'm basically looking for a near new 2nd hand performance car no older then 2-3yrs under 40 grand. With running costs such as fuel and the ablity for my wife to drive it safely are some major concerns.
There is a lot out there!

What I'm looking for is the most luxurious performance car, so with all the options and the performance.
(tho I have been looking at used supras hehe)

[OZChris]

no need for apologies :)
I haven't considered the 6 MPS, I'm basically looking for a near new 2nd hand performance car no older then 2-3yrs under 40 grand. With running costs such as fuel and the ablity for my wife to drive it safely are some major concerns.
There is a lot out there!

What I'm looking for is the most luxurious performance car, so with all the options and the performance.
(tho I have been looking at used supras hehe)

Tommi, we bought a 'base' 6 MPS (ie no BOSE, leather or sunroof) and it was about $36,000 (after neg). It had 8000 kms on the clock and was 15 months old. Safety wise (apart from AWD), it has the usual ABS, DSC, 6 air bags, etc. It was the right buy for us :)

[VZKOOP]

What I'm looking for is the most luxurious performance car, so with all the options and the performance.

That's why I suggested SS & Calais - They have everything. If that's not enough then maybe you need to be looking at an Aston Martin and if that's not enough then let me suggest the Pagani Zonda (And if you do happen to buy one of those please feel free to let me have a drive....... :D )

[Tommi]

I'm not really interested in v8's unless the manufacture has a bull or horse on the emblem.. and yes I have suggested that we buy a zonda however the topic of money & living arrangements in cardboard boxes came up.

2000 B5 Nogaro Blue S4, APR Stage 1, APR Bi-pipe, Forge DV, Stratmosphere SS, Phatnoise, Nav Plus, EBC Rotors.

I test drove the SRI however it wasn't as fast as I thought it would be. Still very nice.

[VZKOOP]

So what is your budget?

[xplosv57]

Twin Turbo V6 with approx 190KW standard - Let's say he's managed to squeeze another 40 out of it with a chip and "tweaks"......

The only thing that you'll buy standard that isn't an 8 or worth 100K plus is probably a STi or EVO (You'd hardly call an EVO luxury though). Otherwise go buy a VZ SS or Calais get a catback, OTRCAI & Mafless Edit. You'll have about 235KW at the tyres, you'll have change out of $40K and your mate won't know which way you went. He'll still be driving an Audi so he probably won't care........

Couldn't agree more, i also wanted a luxury car but with a bit of go, so after considering a few options, the best choice out there was a Calais, has all the fruits plus after extractors, exhaust and a MAF edit, its sitting on 232kW at the wheels, definetely should give an S4 a run for its money!!!

[VZKOOP]

Have you taken it to Calder?
It should be good for low 13's and maybe even a high 12 with that setup.
And there are very few S4's that will compete with that. Still it's not a F430 so Tommie doesn't like it. LOL.....

[xplosv57]

Next few weeks should be heading down to get a base figure, still has the standard diff gears so i'm hoping for a low 14, high 13 sec 1/4!!! Once the diff is done, then the cam and OTR will be done, should be good for a high 12 then, like yours is doing!!!

[Tommi]

lol you guessed my favourite car on earth the F430 I love every single bit about it (minus price tag) mmmmm brb going to watch f430 vids :P

40 k and under is my budget
Is there way to get those opel turbo lotus cars in oz? (memory blank)

With commo's & wrx's etc they annoy me because a new model comes out every year... unlike the TS shape astra which was around for a while!! I believe when you have a nice shape stick to it and don't change it every year because the resale value is effected.

Another thing I'm looking for is purpose built performance cars, because you don't have to push it in order to have fun, ie: you can rev it to 6000rpm and won't feel guilty!

[VZKOOP]

Next few weeks should be heading down to get a base figure, still has the standard diff gears so i'm hoping for a low 14, high 13 sec 1/4!!! Once the diff is done, then the cam and OTR will be done, should be good for a high 12 then, like yours is doing!!!

What are the diff gears in it now?
Mine are 3.46's - standard. That time was done without a histall. Now I have a 3000 histall but I need to upgrade the valve springs to duals because there is valve float at 6500-7000 RPM with my 918's. .
As they say more power = more problems.
Should be able to crack a low 12 once that is done. Not too keen to go for 3.9's as I do a fair amount of highway driving so I like the reasonable fuel economy I am still getting. But having said that 3.9's would definately see high 11's......
I might even go for a decent cam as well when I do the springs - it's only a small 216/224 at the moment, thinking of going for a 228/232. Should get me closer to 290 at the tyres. Then I shouldn't need the 3.9's to make an 11 second pass.

[VZKOOP]

lol you guessed my favourite car on earth the F430 I love every single bit about it (minus price tag) mmmmm brb going to watch f430 vids :P

40 k and under is my budget
Is there way to get those opel turbo lotus cars in oz? (memory blank)

With commo's & wrx's etc they annoy me because a new model comes out every year... unlike the TS shape astra which was around for a while!! I believe when you have a nice shape stick to it and don't change it every year because the resale value is effected.

Another thing I'm looking for is purpose built performance cars, because you don't have to push it in order to have fun, ie: you can rev it to 6000rpm and won't feel guilty!

LS1's love to rev. They work best at high RPM. With a cam they make good power from 3000 to 7000RPM - with heads they will rev to 7500 and scare the crap out of anyone driving a F430.
A 2nd hand HSV VY R8 will set you back around 35K and if it's not already modded and putting 230 plus to the ground, the extra 5K will get you at least 255 - 260. Plus it will have decent suspension and brakes to match and there are plenty around with under 50,000 on the clock (Not even properly run in yet) :D ...... But hey if you want to buy a 2nd hand TS SRi T the additional 18K in change should be able to get you close to 200 at the tyres and with the weight advantage that would be a beast. Don't know how much fun the torque steer and front wheel drive would be with that kind of power but it'd be worth the scare/adrenalin rush to find out.

[xplosv57]

I have 3.07 gears now, standard on lower spec V8's, im going for 3.9s as most my driving is stop/start, so won't make a difference in economy for me!!

Hmm i would've thought a 3k hi stall would be a nightmare on fuel for a daily driver??

P.S. sorry to crash the thread lol

[VZKOOP]

I have 3.07 gears now, standard on lower spec V8's, im going for 3.9s as most my driving is stop/start, so won't make a difference in economy for me!!

Hmm i would've thought a 3k hi stall would be a nightmare on fuel for a daily driver??

P.S. sorry to crash the thread lol
It's a new Dominator 3000. Very tight, very little flare and although the economy has dropped it's only about .5l per 100K's so it was worth the money. I wouldn't go back now. Instant power just about everywhere.
Does 12.9 on my street tyres (Zero traction off the line) and the same on a set of ET Streets (With conversion they are like having 2.9's :eek: )

[Tommi]

You see the problem with getting a R8 with massive horse power and crazy torque that can do a 11 sec quater and stop on a dime is that its all useless once you come to a corner .... I guess you can slow down really quick.. roll around and then take off down the straight again... I'm looking for something that can do both go quick and corner... :P

Reading some reports on the VXR ... it has been suggested that it torque steers excessivly ... so my question is.. how much slower around a twisty track would a SRI be compared to a VXR ... or would they both just plow off the first corner with understeer???

[Miyagi]

Reading some reports on the VXR ... it has been suggested that it torque steers excessivly ... so my question is.. how much slower around a twisty track would a SRI be compared to a VXR ... or would they both just plow off the first corner with understeer???

Torque Steer in the VXR for most intensive purposes is a myth unless you go looking for it... The VXR won a round @ the Dutton Rally recently! LINK! (http://www.hsvvxr.com/forums/index.php?topic=72.0)

[VZKOOP]

So do you want to beat your freind in the Audi in a straight line or around a race track? The R8 will probably help you to do both. If you think an R8 rolls around corners you've never been in one. Granted they are not as nimble as a small car in the tight stuff but on fast flat sweeping bends they are rock solid. Most complaints about their suspension was that it was to hard - too track focused.
Anyway, you have $40K. An AH SRI Turbo isn't going to do the trick. A VXR isn't either and is likely to set you back for over $40K. You also said it had to be top line luxury. Well neither of those cars would classify for that. Good luck finding what you want.

[Tommi]

Thats awesome!

However the Evans mentions he had taken the ESP off? I didn't think this was possible ?
The AH SRI-T I drove from what I saw and was told ... had no buttons to turn it off
What other differences are there between the SRI and VXR?
(Besides Turbo size, ecu and mag wheels)

VZKOOP - I was only joking about the R8 :)
I have a lot of respect for the muscle cars, and yes your correct I have never been in one. I only stated the cornering on what i was lead to believe from talking to people whom mostly are biased to smaller cars.

The SRI I would say is the top of range best value hatch on the market, from the cars I have researched in the same price bracket the SRI has more options then the rest. And thats what I'm looking for. The best bang for my buck! :)
I didn't mean to sound like a smart arse in my previous response, I apologise if it seemed that way instead I was attempting to provoke a response.

Anyhow, there are some VXR's for under 40 however all in victoria.

[Shaun]

We went through a similar dilemma earlier this year when 'upgrading' my wife's Cooper S; we looked at VXR, XR5, Golf GTi, and 3 MPS. It was an interesting exercise as things that we had not considered knocked options out.

Elimination notes:
- XR5: the boot size was not much bigger than the Cooper S - which was one of the reasons for upgrading; price you pay for the dual exhaust I guess :p
- Golf GTi: looks too much like any other Golf :eek:
- VXR and 3 MPS: great power but would be lethal in the wet :D

We ended up with a 6 MPS; bigger but the AWD and 190 kw puts big :D on the driver's face. Plus the added room helps with little ones :). The 6 MPS handles very well too.

Apologies for the long reply on the Opel forum, just thought that I'd share ;)

What basis of evidence that Both the MPS 3 and HSV VXR would be lethal in the wet?

[OZChris]

What basis of evidence that Both the MPS 3 and HSV VXR would be lethal in the wet?

A memorable occasion in the MPS 3 was sliding through a roundabout during a test drive, then again it might have been the driver :D

[luvpsi]

A memorable occasion in the MPS 3 was sliding through a roundabout during a test drive, then again it might have been the driver :D

sounds like it might have been:) both the MPS and VXR are equipped with enough gagets to aid the driver in these situations;)

[OZChris]

sounds like it might have been:) both the MPS and VXR are equipped with enough gagets to aid the driver in these situations;)

Hmmm, I think we had turned the DSC off at that stage to have a little bit of fun :D

[Tommi]

Hmmm, I think we had turned the DSC off at that stage to have a little bit of fun :D

You can do that in the MPS and not the VXR???

[Wraith]

So do you want to beat your freind in the Audi in a straight line or around a race track? The R8 will probably help you to do both. If you think an R8 rolls around corners you've never been in one. Granted they are not as nimble as a small car in the tight stuff but on fast flat sweeping bends they are rock solid. Most complaints about their suspension was that it was to hard - too track focused.
Anyway, you have $40K. An AH SRI Turbo isn't going to do the trick. A VXR isn't either and is likely to set you back for over $40K. You also said it had to be top line luxury. Well neither of those cars would classify for that. Good luck finding what you want.

Couldn't agree more....the above description of a VY or even VT R8 is accurate !

There's always alot of totally erroneous critism here regarding HSV V8 sedans and most come from people who've never even sat in one !

Having owned the previous model VT series 2 HSV R8 with harrops and having test driven the VXR, considering the stated budget and requirements, my pick would also definitely be an older VT or VY R8.

However, each to their own, if you don't like the looks of the HSV Commo or the big size of the sedan, or don't want a V8, or whatever, then it'll have to be one of these other types of hatches, but as as said above, none combines everything your looking for in the one package ;)

[gman]

I've driven the GTi Golf with the DSG and its fantastic...If it was a complete semi auto that let you change only when you want it would be perfect, but the computer does still on rare occasions over ride your decisions...But it still beats a manual in 99% of situations..

As for the XR5, I thought it was to heavy and seems to "lumber" around corners. It has good corner speed and stays settled through the corner not needing a lot of work from the driver, but it feels slow and its not so good on the change of direction (left to right "S" type corners etc) with all that weight moving around...

The Astra's, both older G and newer SRi and VXR, are less refined and take a bit more work to drive fast. But, they feel lighter and more involving and are definately better on change of direction. If you get the exit right, its quicker out of the corners. You just need to drive "smoothly" to overcome some of the flaws of the VXR, like the lack of an LSD which would fix a lot of the probs.

IMHO, if you were going to buy a hot hatch, you'd buy a Golf or XR5 if you want 5 doors and a more "civilised" drive. The VXR if you don't need the extra doors and want something a bit more "edgey".

If money's no object then a Golf R32 but my pick would be the new Audi S3 AWD 2.0 TFSi with a DSG is about as good as it gets. MTM are getting around 330/340HP with just exhaust and a re-tune.... :D

[Wraith]

Nice figures.....

I knew it was possible to get anywhere from 195-215kw at the flywheel, from the donk in the Mk V Golf Gti with re-maps and exhaust only - is it exactly the same engine in the Audi S3 or does it have a bigger turbo and/or other goodies to achieve the 250kw listed above ??

I also assume then that the same can be done with the new Audi TT...

Oh, forgot to mention, when I last enquired with p/c Oz. they reckon the DSG in the Golf can't handle more than about 350nm torque and that VW has had quite a lot of service calls with failed units.

So is the DSG different as well or are they all using the same gearboxes - with those power levels listed above, I'm sure the toeque figure is well over the 350nm mark...

[VZKOOP]

Here's some info on what you can do with the GTi - http://www.oettinger.com.au/oau_vwgolf5gti_et.html
And the new S3 - http://www.oettinger.com.au/oau_audis38p_et.html

[Wraith]

Good and interesting info there, I've seen similar from other tuners.

No mention however about gearboxes behind the engines.

If you talk to powerchip Australia, they have 2 different tunes for this engine, because of the DSG not being able to cope with more than 350nm, so they say......

I wonder if these tuners bother with any of that or not ??

Also interesting to see the acceleration time improvements - I would have thought that an increase from 147 - 228kw would result in a better 0-100km time improvement of 7.2 down to 5.9, maybe traction is an issue :rolleyes:

On a re-read, in fact they do mention the gearboxes - missed it 1st time, looks like they max out the torque at 390nm for the DSG..

[bornwild]

Yes, the XR5 is a better all-rounder than the VXR and probably a better choice car for the casual guy who wants to enjoy a drive down to great ocean road than the VXR.

BUT, I'd still get the VXR over the XR5....can't really explain why, there's just something to it....being a bad boy I guess!?

Anyhow, as for the "An R8 is better than a hot hatch debate".....depends. On a track, they'd be pretty close.

And the DSG is designed for ~750Nm maximum torque.(Safety factor being around 2.0ish I believe). Note:They use a DSG in the 1600Nm Bugatti Veyron.

[Wraith]

Yes, well aware of that, but that's definately a different gearbox to that in the Golfs...

It does however look like that the DSG's in the Golf's etc. are torque stress limited - the tuner noted by VZKOOP go to no more 390nm and powerchip go to no more than 350nm for the DSG - obviously it'll fail beyond that.

[bornwild]

Yes, well aware of that, but that's definately a different gearbox to that in the Golfs...

It does however look like that the DSG's in the Golf's etc. are torque stress limited - the tuner noted by VZKOOP go to no more 390nm and powerchip go to no more than 350nm for the DSG - obviously it'll fail beyond that.

No, that is false information. A safety factor of 2.0ish means that the optimal torque for a DSG is 750/2=375Nm. Optimum means that there is almost 0% chance of anything breaking due to unexpected stresses or miscalculations in material strength etc. Anything beyond 375 will work but expect the lifetime of the gearbox to decrease significantly and hence expect failures to occur more often. Theoretically it should work up to 750Nm without problems, reality of course does not coincide with theory on this case. My guess is that 450 would be the maximum advisable torque to transfer through the box.

I have seen a tuned 3.2l Audi TT-turbo that produces 505Nm using this very same 6sp DSG, not sure if they re-inforce it. It was an MTM RTT 400 RS, here is the link:
http://www.autobild.de/test/neuwagen/artikel.php?artikel_id=14266&artikel_seite=1

[dug74]

Great little read...glad to see someone dug up this post...

Well i have driven all the hot hatches...and i like things from all of them...

As for the XR5...nearly owned a nice Electric Orange with Leather..and i wouldnt compare that to a SRiT...considering it was $41K d/away and a 4 months wait.

As for your comments on the VXR with torque steer....you ppl must all have tuckshop arms....put boths hands on the wheel..and you wont have a problem..

MPS3....now..im rather bias here....but torque steer isnt an issue..torque and boost limited in 1st and 2nd gear...LSD as well...geezz mazda are clever.

Has 2 final drive ratios in 5th and 6th gear...so you can have economy or performance....geezz mazda are clever again.

Price....well they are all about the same...depends if you want 3 drs, nice kit and ugly interior<VXR> 5 drs, 4 seats no cruise and expensive orange paint <XR5> or 5 drs picnic looking seats or leather, DSG and many other options bring it to $45K+ <Golf> or plain sleeper look styling, 5drs 5 seats, cloth or half leather, HID, LSD, 6stk MPS3 BOSE system and 190Kw stock...anything french i didnt bother with...they are unreliable..expensive to service and basically crap.

As for commonwhores or there performance brothers....always great to hear a V8..nice on the straight...corner coming up....oops missed it.

But hey...plenty more hot hatches appearing...Honda Civic Type R..released in a few days.. $39990

Open your eyes...no one has brand loyality these days...hence the reason why car companies are placing as many gadgets, safety features and styling cues in their cars and selling them competitively.

You buy a usually for a purpose, family orientated, sports, daily driver...not for the badge on the front..unless its $150K+

MPS6 is my choice of the best all rounder family/performance car...and will out shine a HSV clubbie anyday...maybe not straight line...but with 2x more cylinders and nearly 3x more Litres and 2x more fuel....with only marginal better times...you gotta wonder what all the fuss is about.

I wonder if we read this post in another years time...how ppls comments will change again...as more variety enters the market.

Cheers
DUG74

[Miyagi]

Wanna see the mazda 3 mps get around the Nürburgring?

Thought So! (http://www.hsvvxr.com/forums/index.php?topic=86.0) :cool:

[OZChris]

... and then there's always the Top Gear MPS6 / Vectra VXR / Mondeo G220 comparo http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bm1PJFeOYVw

[gman]

The MPS3 has its fair share of problems with traction and handling, just like the VXR, Golf or XR5. The MPS3, and the "clever" people at Mazda haven't found the answer to the FWD problem of having 1 set of wheels steer, power and stop a car by a long shot..

The MPS3's 2.3Lt Duratec Ford sourced engine tends to use a fair bit of petrol too, which i've had friends who own them complain about....But, that said, it's a "good" all round, quicker than average shopping trolley...

As for torque steer, the VXR, Golf or XR5 doesn't have torque steer any worse than each other or any other higher powered FWD car and the MPS3 is exactly the same, LSD or not. Push the MPS3 hard and it plough understeers just like the others, except with 2 wheels spinning instead of one....

So even with an LSD and torque limited in 1st & 2nd (which the VXR is also through boost -ain't those Germans smart) the MPS3 has the same traction probs as the VXR, XR5 or Golf.

And there have been a few MAJOR quality control scares for the MPS3 in Aust too (maybe Mazda ain't so smart - he he he) ;)

The MPS3 is heavier like the XR5 is which makes the handling, IMHO, feel "dull" and you can really feel the extra weight moving around..Don't like the steering, feels lifeless...

But I like the interior with the Half Leather / Bose "OPTION" and piano black interior trim on the MPS3 is prob the best of the bunch. The outside though is a bit "shopping cart grandma chic" for me...Some say sleeper, I say granny... ;)

The XR5 & VXR both has Recaro's if you want them so there's really nothing in it there....

The Golf has the best gearbox in the DSG, best build quality and good interior when you spring for the leather option.....It handles great when pushed but is starting to show its lack of power with the newer hot hatches...

So whats the difference then. Well IMHO, its just 2 doors or 4, 100kg's or so up or down (which cancels any power advantage for the MPS3 or torque advantage for the XR5 5cyl Volvo engine which sounds awesome BTW) and an LSD..

So really it's the "do you like the look of it" arguement...VXR is the best looking IMHO....

When it comes to cost, really between a VXR, XR5, MPS3 or Golf you're talking about just about the the same amount of money for the similar trim levels, give or take a leather seat and $5,000 or so. Nothing really, which makes it a hard choice...

Me, I would buy a VXR and add an LSD, exhaust and re-flash over the XR5 (to heavy, don't like the handling), Golf (underpowered now which is a real pity) or MPS3 (to heavy, don't like the handling and don't like the looks)...

But thats just me.. ;)

[JohnBu]

Has 2 final drive ratios in 5th and 6th gear...so you can have economy or performance....geezz mazda are clever again.

MPS6 is my choice .... 2x more fuel....

i was led to believe that the MPS3 and 6 (to a lesser extent XR5) had terrible fuel consumption.

what are you getting on average?

madza, should really put that 2.3l turbo donk in the RX8, i would think that would make it a very complete car..

[OZChris]

i was led to believe that the MPS3 and 6 (to a lesser extent XR5) had terrible fuel consumption.

what are you getting on average?

madza, should really put that 2.3l turbo donk in the RX8, i would think that would make it a very complete car..

My wifes MPS6 reads high 12s on the computer for average consumption - her driving pattern is stop start and short runs (like any mum); it's much better on the highway :)

[Wraith]

The MPS3 has its fair share of problems with traction and handling, just like the VXR, Golf or XR5. The MPS3, and the "clever" people at Mazda haven't found the answer to the FWD problem of having 1 set of wheels steer, power and stop a car by a long shot..

The MPS3's 2.3Lt Duratec Ford sourced engine tends to use a fair bit of petrol too, which i've had friends who own them complain about....But, that said, it's a "good" all round, quicker than average shopping trolley...

As for torque steer, the VXR, Golf or XR5 doesn't have torque steer any worse than each other or any other higher powered FWD car and the MPS3 is exactly the same, LSD or not. Push the MPS3 hard and it plough understeers just like the others, except with 2 wheels spinning instead of one....

So even with an LSD and torque limited in 1st & 2nd (which the VXR is also through boost -ain't those Germans smart) the MPS3 has the same traction probs as the VXR, XR5 or Golf.

And there have been a few MAJOR quality control scares for the MPS3 in Aust too (maybe Mazda ain't so smart - he he he) ;)

The MPS3 is heavier like the XR5 is which makes the handling, IMHO, feel "dull" and you can really feel the extra weight moving around..Don't like the steering, feels lifeless...

But I like the interior with the Half Leather / Bose "OPTION" and piano black interior trim on the MPS3 is prob the best of the bunch. The outside though is a bit "shopping cart grandma chic" for me...Some say sleeper, I say granny... ;)

The XR5 & VXR both has Recaro's if you want them so there's really nothing in it there....

The Golf has the best gearbox in the DSG, best build quality and good interior when you spring for the leather option.....It handles great when pushed but is starting to show its lack of power with the newer hot hatches...

So whats the difference then. Well IMHO, its just 2 doors or 4, 100kg's or so up or down (which cancels any power advantage for the MPS3 or torque advantage for the XR5 5cyl Volvo engine which sounds awesome BTW) and an LSD..

So really it's the "do you like the look of it" arguement...VXR is the best looking IMHO....

When it comes to cost, really between a VXR, XR5, MPS3 or Golf you're talking about just about the the same amount of money for the similar trim levels, give or take a leather seat and $5,000 or so. Nothing really, which makes it a hard choice...

Me, I would buy a VXR and add an LSD, exhaust and re-flash over the XR5 (to heavy, don't like the handling), Golf (underpowered now which is a real pity) or MPS3 (to heavy, don't like the handling and don't like the looks)...

But thats just me.. ;)

All good points and good reasoning........then how about getting a golf and adding LSD and reflash, instead of a VXR ??

Your lack of power prob. is solved, as they can be mapped alone with no other mod what so ever to at least 196kw and 400nm, add your LSD and you have what you want...

And that would give you the best all round package maybe ?? ie: if your happy with the end price ;)

[GreyRex]

The MPS3 has its fair share of problems with traction and handling, just like the VXR, Golf or XR5. The MPS3, and the "clever" people at Mazda haven't found the answer to the FWD problem of having 1 set of wheels steer, power and stop a car by a long shot..

The MPS3's 2.3Lt Duratec Ford sourced engine tends to use a fair bit of petrol too, which i've had friends who own them complain about....But, that said, it's a "good" all round, quicker than average shopping trolley...

As for torque steer, the VXR, Golf or XR5 doesn't have torque steer any worse than each other or any other higher powered FWD car and the MPS3 is exactly the same, LSD or not. Push the MPS3 hard and it plough understeers just like the others, except with 2 wheels spinning instead of one....

So even with an LSD and torque limited in 1st & 2nd (which the VXR is also through boost -ain't those Germans smart) the MPS3 has the same traction probs as the VXR, XR5 or Golf.

And there have been a few MAJOR quality control scares for the MPS3 in Aust too (maybe Mazda ain't so smart - he he he) ;)

The MPS3 is heavier like the XR5 is which makes the handling, IMHO, feel "dull" and you can really feel the extra weight moving around..Don't like the steering, feels lifeless...

But I like the interior with the Half Leather / Bose "OPTION" and piano black interior trim on the MPS3 is prob the best of the bunch. The outside though is a bit "shopping cart grandma chic" for me...Some say sleeper, I say granny... ;)

The XR5 & VXR both has Recaro's if you want them so there's really nothing in it there....

The Golf has the best gearbox in the DSG, best build quality and good interior when you spring for the leather option.....It handles great when pushed but is starting to show its lack of power with the newer hot hatches...

So whats the difference then. Well IMHO, its just 2 doors or 4, 100kg's or so up or down (which cancels any power advantage for the MPS3 or torque advantage for the XR5 5cyl Volvo engine which sounds awesome BTW) and an LSD..

So really it's the "do you like the look of it" arguement...VXR is the best looking IMHO....

When it comes to cost, really between a VXR, XR5, MPS3 or Golf you're talking about just about the the same amount of money for the similar trim levels, give or take a leather seat and $5,000 or so. Nothing really, which makes it a hard choice...

Me, I would buy a VXR and add an LSD, exhaust and re-flash over the XR5 (to heavy, don't like the handling), Golf (underpowered now which is a real pity) or MPS3 (to heavy, don't like the handling and don't like the looks)...

But thats just me.. ;)

Isn't that a little in depth lol!! Just choose what you like!!

[Wraith]

No, that is false information. A safety factor of 2.0ish means that the optimal torque for a DSG is 750/2=375Nm. Optimum means that there is almost 0% chance of anything breaking due to unexpected stresses or miscalculations in material strength etc. Anything beyond 375 will work but expect the lifetime of the gearbox to decrease significantly and hence expect failures to occur more often. Theoretically it should work up to 750Nm without problems, reality of course does not coincide with theory on this case. My guess is that 450 would be the maximum advisable torque to transfer through the box.

I have seen a tuned 3.2l Audi TT-turbo that produces 505Nm using this very same 6sp DSG, not sure if they re-inforce it. It was an MTM RTT 400 RS, here is the link:
http://www.autobild.de/test/neuwagen/artikel.php?artikel_id=14266&artikel_seite=1

I'd say they've done something to strengthen the DSG or it's a different model DSG as it feeds drive to all 4 wheels, it may be a stronger unit.

I don't know what the factory quoted figures are on the torque limits of the DSG in the Golf's etc. but if tuners are limiting power outputs as I've already noted, then there must be a limit well below the figures you've stated.

If you speak to p/c Oz they'll tell you that VW have had alot of problems with DSG's 'hacking up' so I doubt the DSG units fitted to Golf's and the like can handle anywhere near 700+nm.

Remember DSG is just a term to describe the type of gearbox, but there would be different models or units used by VW depending on the application, I doubt they're all the same.

The Veyron would obviously have a DSG gearbox specifically designed for it's unique application.

[OPC]

Gman... that post was hilarious...

DUG... i like the tuckshop arms comment

[dug74]

The MPS3 is heavier like the XR5 is which makes the handling, IMHO, feel "dull" and you can really feel the extra weight moving around..Don't like the steering, feels lifeless...


And to be also correct....the MPS3 aint that heavy.

Golf GTI with/without DSG

147Kw 1340kgs = 9.12kg/Kw

Civic Type R

148Kw 1345kg = 9.11kg/Kw

VXR

177Kw 1393kg = 7.87kg/Kw

MPS3 Base

190Kw 1403kg = 7.38kg/Kw

MPS3 Sports

190Kw 1415kg = 7.44kg/Kw

XR5 Both models

166Kw 1442 = 8.69kg/Kw

But...as with all the hot hatches...you cant judge on a 10 min or 1hr test drive....you really need to own them...they are drivers cars....

Cheers
DUG74

[OPC]

VXR

177Kw 1393kg = 7.87kg/Kw

MPS3 Base

190Kw 1403kg = 7.38kg/Kw

MPS3 Sports

190Kw 1415kg = 7.44kg/Kw

Cheers
DUG74

10KG / 22KG not much ay

how much extra do you pay for SPORT dug ?
and what do you get for the extra $$$$

[dug74]

10KG / 22KG not much ay

how much extra do you pay for SPORT dug ?
and what do you get for the extra $$$$

Well the Sport is about $3000 more...but if you haggle like i did you can get it for not much more than base..

Extras...

Bose 7 speaker 6 stack MP3 Player with Ipod jack
High Gloss Alloy Wheels
HID Xenon Headlights
Half Leather Seats

May not sound worth the money...but the bose stereo and xenons are worth the extra $$$ IMO.

[OPC]

Well the Sport is about $3000 more...but if you haggle like i did you can get it for not much more than base..

Extras...

Bose 7 speaker 6 stack MP3 Player with Ipod jack
High Gloss Alloy Wheels
HID Xenon Headlights
Half Leather Seats

May not sound worth the money...but the bose stereo and xenons are worth the extra $$$ IMO.

yeah i reckon they are worth the $$$ aswell... the only thing i dont like about the 3 is the wheels... thats it...

[dug74]

Thanks mohawk..

I really dont understand why HSV didnt release the Astra with HID and MP3 player...

Also..with the mazda only a few kilograms heavier than the astra...would that becoz it has 2 extra doors.

So when you think about it...really the VXR is kinda porky for a hot hatch as well....the XR5 is just plain silly...less power and heaps of weight....

I respect the VXR...im a fan of the exterior like i have said...look very aggressive and stylish...but looks dont make performance...and ppl need to remember there are plain jane cars out there....with many hidden features..

Plus i have seen the FMIC on the standard SRiT and its the size of a A4 piece of paper...are the VXR bigger.

Cheers
DUG74

[gman]

And to be also correct....the MPS3 aint that heavy.


So, as stated correctly, the MPS3 "IS" heavier, thanks for proving my point, cheers.

I didn't say by how much, but Mohawk is right 20+kgs is is more than enough to be felt. Especially when most of it is in engine and suspension weight over or infront of the front wheels like in the MPS3.

I "DID" however, specify that the extra weight, while through implication only, that the setup made it feel dull, lifeless and heavy. I didn't go into specific's but the MPS3 after a full day of driving more than 200km's felt overly front heavy with little steering feedback and had a tendancy to understeer badly and roll when pushed through the twisty bits (Old Pacific Hwy - Sydney to Central Coast & back - My favourite road).

IMHO, the spring/shock rates could be changed, I didn't like the way the LSD locked up mid corner when the power was re-applied, the car felt undertyred with only 215/45/18 tyres (VXR @ 235/35/19 / XR5 @ 225/40/18 IIRC), the centre of gravity is to high (MPS3 @ 1465mm high vs VXR @ 1420mm / XR5 @ 1447mm) causing the car to pitch and roll more than others. But it has a goo interior and is quick in a straight line...Kind of like a Soccer mum's drag car....I don't think any of them could really be called a "Drivers" car, but the MPS3 is the least tuned to being a sports car of all of the current Hot hatches.

Mohawk: glad to give ay a laugh....I'm here all week... ;)

[OPC]

Thanks mohawk..

Also..with the mazda only a few kilograms heavier than the astra...would that becoz it has 2 extra doors.

So when you think about it...really the VXR is kinda porky for a hot hatch as well....

Plus i have seen the FMIC on the standard SRiT and its the size of a A4 piece of paper...are the VXR bigger.

Cheers
DUG74

have you felt how heavy 1 door of the VXR is ? hahahaha heeeeavy
plus we have heavier wheels than the 3mps HAHAHAHA

and as u said the VXR is kinda porky for a hot hatch it's only 0.43kg/kw heavier than the SPORT and 13kw less

the I/C on the SRi is it the same as the G SRi ? cos that was really tiny...
but it's NOT the same as the VXR I/C
our one is huge compared to the OLD G I/C

what's the 3mps I/C like ? is it top mounted ? little bit bigger than a rex I/C ?

[dug74]

http://www.familycar.com/RoadTests/MazdaSpeed6/Images/Engine.jpg

http://www.grohol.com/mazda/mspeed6Gallery10.jpg

[gman]

Its a good size stock, How thick is it?

But same as the WRX / STi as its on top of the engine...OK while moving but its really an "inter-heater" when you stop and acts like a heat sink...

Heat soak also was a huge prob on my STi until I got a FMIC....Plazmaman do a FMIC for the MPS3, good size increase and think it would make a difference too...

Just a side note, see how far forward of the strut towers the engine is....Good for straight line traction and braking where the MPS3 excels, not so good for a corner....

Still a nice all rounder....Especially with the Bose stereo...they sound SWEEEEEEETTTTTT!!! ;)

[OPC]

DUG is there any room in the front for a front mount ?

[rusole21]

they are putting front mounts on at speedworks. been doin it for a while. the sales guy at mazda say they can get huge power. didnt say much about it tho.

[gman]

http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t262/aussiegman/mps202.jpg

http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t262/aussiegman/mps203.jpg

http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t262/aussiegman/MPS201.jpg

Just wat I've seen

[JohnBu]

I really dont understand why HSV didnt release the Astra with HID and MP3 player...


HIDs should be an option and MP3 should be std.

anyway whats the fuel consumption like?

[OPC]

those pics look awesome g man

cant wait n see what power they can run with remaps aswell

[gman]

those pics look awesome g man

cant wait n see what power they can run with remaps aswell

Plazmaman does really goos work, but it is really expensive too...

They will be quick on the 1/4 thats for sure with a re-flash, FMIC and maybe a 50 shot of NOS ;)

[Jass]

Plazmaman does really goos work, but it is really expensive too...

They will be quick on the 1/4 thats for sure with a re-flash, FMIC and maybe a 50 shot of NOS ;)

They still have a fat ass! there nose heavy and all in all, its the sorta car your gf would drive to netball practise on weekends!

[dug74]

They still have a fat ass! there nose heavy and all in all, its the sorta car your gf would drive to netball practise on weekends!

ROFL....too funny...

I bet you wouldnt be saying that if you were behind the wheel or even a passenger in a mazda with those mods...

Seriously...i know this Opelaus...RESPECT... but dont under rate the mazda becoz it has bland styling...

Thanks g-man...i can find a few other pics as well from the OMC forum...

Also pics of the new garrett bolt on turbo to replace the stock K04....no mods required...

Its jap....plenty of mods available...GOT RICE!

Cheers
DUG74

[OPC]

fukin oath japs rule for easy bolt ons... i hate you dug :(

[lampshade]

Dont the Vxr's here come with mp3 and RDS:confused:

[Wraith]

http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t262/aussiegman/mps202.jpg

http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t262/aussiegman/mps203.jpg

http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t262/aussiegman/MPS201.jpg

Just wat I've seen

That looks impressive !!!

Is that local or O/S and whats the power output of this set up ??

Dug can confirm, there's a straight bolt on turbo upgrade for both MPS3 and MPS6 from the U.S. that puts MPS6's in the 12sec zone over the 1/4....anyone fitted it to a MPS3 yet ??

[rusole21]

I bet you wouldnt be saying that if you were behind the wheel or even a passenger in a mazda with those mods...



Its jap....plenty of mods available...GOT RICE!

Cheers
DUG74
what do you mean dug? that people would acctually say stuff on this forum that they really have no idea about?? NO. i dont believe you.

dam right. jap rules!!!

[bornwild]

I'd say they've done something to strengthen the DSG or it's a different model DSG as it feeds drive to all 4 wheels, it may be a stronger unit.

I don't know what the factory quoted figures are on the torque limits of the DSG in the Golf's etc. but if tuners are limiting power outputs as I've already noted, then there must be a limit well below the figures you've stated.

If you speak to p/c Oz they'll tell you that VW have had alot of problems with DSG's 'hacking up' so I doubt the DSG units fitted to Golf's and the like can handle anywhere near 700+nm.

Remember DSG is just a term to describe the type of gearbox, but there would be different models or units used by VW depending on the application, I doubt they're all the same.

The Veyron would obviously have a DSG gearbox specifically designed for it's unique application.

Nope, it's the same DSG in all current VW Group cars. It's not profitable to have multiple factories for a single-model box. When you think about it, the only difference would be the metal they use when casting, and they buy metal in tons, so the cost difference for them isn't that massive. Now, I've nowhere read about any complaints on the DSG gearbox; I don't know what is up with that.

The only difference between the Veyron's box and the Golf box is that in the Veyron it is a 7sp and uses a different alloy when it's cast.(I read about it a couple of years ago, if I remember correctly it was magnesium+aluminium+titanium)

Next gen golf is going to have a 7sp DSG, and I read a rumour on AutoBild that Porsche is going to be using this as well.

As for the sp23, nice little car with a fair bit of grunt; 190kW isn't a small figure. BUT, it looks horrible...And the difference between a 177kW FWD and a 190kW FWD won't be much, whether it is a straight line or a circuit.

Ford XR5 definitely has the best handling out of all the hatches, HSV VXR has the best looks and Golf is the best choice as an all-rounder.
So, I don't really see the market for an sp23.....:confused:.....maybe grandmums cruising down chappel like sik kunts?? Don't know...

And someone mentioned it, the XR5 has an awesome sound....hell yeah!


I'd buy a VXR if I had the money, because it looks awesome. It's a combination of show and go; exactly what I like. The only thing I would change to 'my VXR' would be the exhaust; I hate the rear-centered single exhaust. I would modify that straight away to a double in front of the rear wheels or behind them. :D:D


ps. Some track-time predictions from me:
1. Golf GTi Edition 30 (167kW) - Tiff Needall picked it over all the other hot hatches
2. Ford XR5 (169kW) - Amazing handling and torque curve
3. HSV VXR (177kW) - The blue color makes it quicker :D
4. Renault Megane 225 (167kW) - little french tin can, not bad....still crap
5. Mazda sp23 (190kW) - the little cross-eyed jap, has no clue where he's headed

Plus I reckon the VXR has the most potential for after-market tuners.

[bornwild]

That looks impressive !!!

Is that local or O/S and whats the power output of this set up ??

Dug can confirm, there's a straight bolt on turbo upgrade for both MPS3 and MPS6 from the U.S. that puts MPS6's in the 12sec zone over the 1/4....anyone fitted it to a MPS3 yet ??

If only the MPS3 was 4WD....mmmmmmm, think of the opportunities, go up to some STi or EVO and kick their ass and then put some old-school CO2 in their face :D:D:D:D

I hope the next-gen of hot hatches will be 4WD :pray::pray::pray:

[rusole21]

^^^ your a tool

its a mps3. not sp23.

if ya cant handle thae fact that the mazda mps3 is quicker and way more tunable then your gonna have a head ache for a while.

[bornwild]

^^^ your a tool

its a mps3. not sp23.

if ya cant handle thae fact that the mazda mps3 is quicker and way more tunable then your gonna have a head ache for a while.


well, they look the same, eyyy....

Quicker....in a straight line.....maybe!

[rusole21]

no maybe about it. its a fact!

[Wraith]

Re: DSG's

mmmmm, still not too sure about that one Bornwild...

I'll have to do some research and find some answers for both of us ;)

I find it difficult to believe the Veyron shares pretty much the same DSG box as the Golf :confused: Sure similar design and an extra gear, but I'll bet it's more than twice or 3 times as strong as it's little siblings DSG boxes !!!

As for DSG issues, don't take my word for it - investigate yourself - as stated I've been told of reliability issues by PowerChip Aust. and as already pointed out other tuners won't go beyond the 390nm mark with their tuning upgrades for DSG equipped Golfs etc......'there must be a reason for this' lol :)

[bornwild]

Not that quicker.

MPS3 0-100 => 6.1
VXR 0-100 => 6.4

Plus you're forgetting it has a huge engine.

[bornwild]

I find it difficult to believe the Veyron shares pretty much the same DSG box as the Golf :confused: Sure similar design and an extra gear, but I'll bet it's more than twice or 3 times as strong as it's little siblings DSG boxes !!!


I said it's cast differently(ie. stronger alloys):p:D:D:D:D:p

ps. Oh I see where you're coming from, when I said VW Group I meant everyone but Bugatti :D :D :D (Bugatti uses a slightly different design also; ie. 7sp instead of 6sp)

[Wraith]

if ya cant handle thae fact that the mazda mps3 is quicker and way more tunable then your gonna have a head ache for a while.

This is very true LOL :D

At the end of the day it's going to come down to personal preference for whatever reasons and looks or individual appeal, but the above fact will remain ;)

[OZChris]

At the end of the day it's going to come down to personal preference for whatever reasons and looks or individual appeal, but the above fact will remain ;)

Agreed, at the end of the day, my preference is to do something different to anyone else - otherwise we'd all be driving round in the same car, same colour, dressed the same, etc :D

[rusole21]

Not that quicker.

MPS3 0-100 => 6.1
VXR 0-100 => 6.4

Plus you're forgetting it has a huge engine.
dugs mps3 has done a 13.9s 1/4 mile
the best i have seen from a vxr is 14.6s 1/4 mile.

just drive both before comenting. its gettin obvious you havent

[bornwild]

dugs mps3 has done a 13.9s 1/4 mile
the best i have seen from a vxr is 14.6s 1/4 mile.

just drive both before comenting. its gettin obvious you havent

I'm the kind of guy to who only track times matter, not straight line. It's easy to make a car go quick in a straight line; get a big engine, put a turbo on it and Voila.

Making it quick around the track is a different story.

[oneightoo]

gius theres only one way to solve this....



CAGE MATCH!

[dug74]

I'm the kind of guy to who only track times matter, not straight line. It's easy to make a car go quick in a straight line; get a big engine, put a turbo on it and Voila.

Making it quick around the track is a different story.

You have obviously shown you have no clue what your talking about...so how can anyone believe your comments about DSG if you cant get a few small facts rights.

1. already said....its a MPS3 ..not a SP23

2. There is a AWD model...it called a MPS6.. same engine..same performance.

3. I have done 13.96 on the track <STOCK> and a friend has cracked 13.6 with CAI.

4. I dont think you should comment on track performance when the MPS3 did a 8mins 35sec on the nurburgring.

5. Opels are German Taxis....simple.

6. VXR has the style...its just a mongrel car with 3 different badges on the same car...becoz they were too tight to make up there mind which model to call it.. OPC, VXR and HSV.

7. Im happy with my purchase.... ARE YOU... jealous much????

8. Also...177Kw and 190Kw...there isnt much difference...but 320Nm and 380Nm is a huge difference...

Cheers
DUG74

Thanks for entertaining me....and also...those 0 - 100 times...i would ignore...becoz i know the MPS and VXR are both quicker than those times...5.8...and 6.2 respectively.

[OPC]

HEY DUG the mps3 did 8 mins 39sec and the VXR did 8 mins 35
but i agree dug... he didnt even know what a BOV was


I'm the kind of guy to who only track times matter, not straight line. It's easy to make a car go quick in a straight line; get a big engine, put a turbo on it and Voila.

Making it quick around the track is a different story.

HAHAHAHAHAHA

what is a BOV again ?????????

[dug74]

HEY DUG the mps3 did 8 mins 39sec and the VXR did 8 mins 35
but i agree dug... he didnt even know what a BOV was



HAHAHAHAHAHA

what is a BOV again ?????????

Sorry mohawk...i was 4 seconds out...but i did know 8min 35s was right for one of them....

Just sick of the bashing my mazda and the MPS in general is getting....its a great car...and ppl need to respect that..as i respect the VXR...its a "hawt" hatch...im rather jealous.

Oh...and bornwild...Track work..hmmm....why would you bother with a hot hatch...they aint really made for the track...they are a hot hatch shopping car...to drive around urban cities...if you want performance on the track...i dont think you will find an opel...maybe try *japanese*..eg RX8, RX7, 350Z, Skyline, S2000...

But hey....what would i know....i only own a SP23 :D

Cheers
DUG74

[OZChris]

Just sick of the bashing my mazda and the MPS in general is getting....its a great car...and ppl need to respect that..as i respect the VXR...its a "hawt" hatch...im rather jealous.

Keep smiling, it's great to see that you're happy with your MPS - that's all that really matters. :D

BTW this is a great thread from an entertainment perspective :D :D :D

[rusole21]

Just sick of the bashing my mazda and the MPS in general is getting....its a great car...and ppl need to respect that..as i respect the VXR...its a "hawt" hatch...im rather jealous.


very true. i love the vxr just as much as anyone else but i also look at the facts. mazda have made a brutal car that is fast and can go round corners!! 10 at targa proves that.

and yes this thread is funny to read. pointless but funny

[bornwild]

1. already said....its a MPS3 ..not a SP23

2. There is a AWD model...it called a MPS6.. same engine..same performance.

3. I have done 13.96 on the track <STOCK> and a friend has cracked 13.6 with CAI.

4. I dont think you should comment on track performance when the MPS3 did a 8mins 35sec on the nurburgring.

5. Opels are German Taxis....simple.

6. VXR has the style...its just a mongrel car with 3 different badges on the same car...becoz they were too tight to make up there mind which model to call it.. OPC, VXR and HSV.

7. Im happy with my purchase.... ARE YOU... jealous much????

8. Also...177Kw and 190Kw...there isnt much difference...but 320Nm and 380Nm is a huge difference...


1. They look the same.
2. It's not an MPS3
3. ....lol
4. VXR quicker
5. lol....I've lived in germany 5yrs and Opel taxis are very, very rare. Or used to be.
6. Go on mazdaaus...
7. Yeah I am cause I only own a CDX.....then again....lol
8. Agreed on that, but then again 2.3l engine

And yeah ... why start insulting ones person? Frustrated with your purchase? :D

[oneightoo]

Just read the Ford Focus XR5 review in this month's Wheels magazine. As everyone has been saying, the wheels team found it to be a great handler and capable when compared to an XR6 turbo and a WRX. Not as quick in a straight line as either of the above (or the VXR) but a well built and polished fun machine. I dont think that $36990 is a bargain for a compact hatchback, but when compared to mid $40K's for a VXR it seems to be money well spent.
Also the lack of an Auto option puts a smile on my face. Learn to drive a car properly you automatic hippies!
If my Astra CDX suddenly increased in value to $36990, id definitely trader her in for a bright orange XR5.

funny to think the first post and the actual title of this thread is what it is..

lol.. amusing thread nonetheless :D

[bornwild]

Oh...and bornwild...Track work..hmmm....why would you bother with a hot hatch...they aint really made for the track...they are a hot hatch shopping car...to drive around urban cities...if you want performance on the track...i dont think you will find an opel...maybe try *japanese*..eg RX8, RX7, 350Z, Skyline, S2000...


C'mon I only give shit to the mazda cause I think it can be so much more if they had done a few things differently :p

As for track car, don't know....Astra X-treme (http://www.supercars.net/cars/1413.html), anyone? :D:D

[bornwild]

HEY DUG the mps3 did 8 mins 39sec and the VXR did 8 mins 35
but i agree dug... he didnt even know what a BOV was



HAHAHAHAHAHA

what is a BOV again ?????????

BOV (http://www.bov.com/)

:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

[dug74]

Thankyou bornwild....you make me smile...

Very frustrated with my purchases..its really hard driving around the *fastest hot hatch*

Im a member of OMC <ozmazdaclub> and XR5...but im also a founding member here...and i dont really think it matter what car you own...the whole point of the forum is information and community <friends, socialising etc>

And i wasnt singling out...i was correcting ppl who make assumptions about are car without really driving it....

And to finalise my debate...i didnt see HSV shelling out a Advanced Drivers Program Day on the track with your own car....Mazda have given this chance to all customers who purchase a MPS3, MPS6, RX8 and even a SP23.

I will be heading to Willowbank on the 3rd July with 24 other ppl owning these cars for my turn on the track.

ZOOM ZOOM :D

Anyways...back on topic...

Id take a VXR over a XR5 anyday...even tho i was a bee's dick away from signing for a XR5 back in Decemeber....if it wasnt for Ford being some generous and making me wait 4 months...i wouldnt have even thought about the Mazda...

THANK YOU FORD...

It always gonna be a FORD Vs HOLDEN in this country...until ppl realise there is more choice and better cars out there...the car companies want you to stay brand loyal....but they actually need to start caring about the customers rather than sales.

Do you think Ford will shoot themselves with the just released XR4 stealing XR5 sales due to limited stock.....as i know the XR5 is fastest etc...but ppl may be content with saving $10k - $15K and 4 months.

Just a thought.

Cheers
DUG74

[OPC]

ur 2 sm4rt 4m3

[gman]

Very frustrated with my purchases..its really hard driving around the *fastest hot hatch*

What aout the R32 Golf and S3 Audi?

[oneightoo]

and then there's the soon to be released sti hatch..

[Rhino]

It was me that doesn't like Audi's - just look boring!
The word you're looking for is understated.

A 'sleeper' Astra is cool...

But a 'sleeper' Audi is boring? Yeah right.


When I last looked an RS4 was about $160,000 - no way!
Ah, you're one of those people that just looks at price and 1/4 mile times...

Driven an RS4?


I'd rather spend $75,000 on an R34GTR plus another $5,000 on an exhaust and Apexi ECU plus air intake kit for 300kws ATW - just like a mate of mine has just done! (aren't there times when 'friends' really manage to piss you off ......... !!)
FYI - 160k is for the base model... ;)

Fk these statements make me shit myself.

I'd buy a 20k bike and still flog the piss out of you...

So, your point being what?

*and to keep this on topic*

I like the orange XR5T (<---- which would be 'exhaust' as a 'wanker plate' :D *shrugs*)

[gman]

ur 2 sm4rt 4m3

We ain't so smart...peoples is just dumber around here :D

http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t262/aussiegman/Cletus.gif

[dug74]

What aout the R32 Golf and S3 Audi?

Sorry gman...your like my wikipedia..

Oh...the fastest fwd hot hatch....and its actually faster than a R32 and S3 in straight line and beaten 0 - 100 by 0.1sec by the S3...damn AWD...better traction.

But hey....gman...you know your stuff as well as a few others here...and it isnt always about performance and looks...practibility and purpose help ppl make their selection of automobile.

And i certainly agree there Rhino....you dont even need to spend $20k on a bike to kill all these $150K+ supercars....

So i will just head off and buy that boring Audi to go with my boring mazda...but i know what i would choose over a Astra or Audi...

Cheers
DUG74

P.S. How are those XR5's going....i have heard not well in all departments except vocals..:D

[Rhino]

So i will just head off and buy that boring Audi...
That's the plan ;)

[bornwild]

Try killing a supercar around the track with a $20k bike :D :D :D :D :D

Though', I wouldn't mind a turbocharged CBR1000...:D

[oneightoo]

And i certainly agree there Rhino....you dont even need to spend $20k on a bike to kill all these $150K+ supercars....

lol buy an R1..

75% of people who own one have accidents..

you'll kill all supercars, and eventually yourself..

but it'd be fun while it lasted :D

[bornwild]

And i wasnt singling out...i was correcting ppl who make assumptions about are car without really driving it....


But I did...and I was disappointed......maybe I was expecting too much :(

I test drove the STi the same day, maybe that's why I was so disappointed.

[dug74]

But I did...and I was disappointed......maybe I was expecting too much :(

I test drove the STi the same day, maybe that's why I was so disappointed.

Maybe....or you just didnt spend enough time in it to enjoy it :D

STi...nice...but totally different car/class and $20K more.

And if you were disappointed by the mazda...you will be surely even more disappointed when you drive the VXR :p

Cheers
DUG74

[Rhino]

Try killing a supercar around the track with a $20k bike :D :D :D :D :D

Though', I wouldn't mind a turbocharged CBR1000...:D
Oh, you can have the 1 second win (if that).

My mate is putting a snail on his busa... a blown 1300... that's rediculous.


lol buy an R1..
haha R1... it's the WRX of the bike world... (clitoris)

R1 riders in general are squids... and have given the bike themselves a bad reputation... cos they get their 250 and then an R1... and don't have any skills...

[gman]

Sorry gman...your like my wikipedia..

Cheers... ;)


But hey....gman...you know your stuff as well as a few others here...and it isnt always about performance and looks...practibility and purpose help ppl make their selection of automobile.

The Mazda is a great all-round performer its true..Its has its flaws just like a VXR or XR5...

If you need something reasonably quick, don't mind the sleeper/stealth/bland/grandma or what ever styling, need to carry the kids/shopping etc and never push 10/10th's (which 99.9% of people never do) then the Mazda's as good as any of them..

If you like a harder edge and don't need the room...Buy a VXR....

Middleground...Buy an XR5....

Money no object...Buy a Veyron.. ;)

[rusole21]

But I did...and I was disappointed......maybe I was expecting too much :(

I test drove the STi the same day, maybe that's why I was so disappointed.
they dont let 17 year olds test drive sti's mate. i assume your 17 cos your a total noob when it comes to knowing anything about cars.

[Rhino]

they dont let 17 year olds test drive sti's mate. i assume your 17 cos you're a total noob when it comes to knowing anything about cars.

You are = You're

Your = possesive

;)

[gman]

You are = You're

Your = possesive

;)

Your = possessive pronouns showing ownership ;) sorry

[Jass]

ROFL....too funny...

I bet you wouldnt be saying that if you were behind the wheel or even a passenger in a mazda with those mods...

Seriously...i know this Opelaus...RESPECT... but dont under rate the mazda becoz it has bland styling...

Thanks g-man...i can find a few other pics as well from the OMC forum...

Also pics of the new garrett bolt on turbo to replace the stock K04....no mods required...

Its jap....plenty of mods available...GOT RICE!

Cheers
DUG74

Thats the point, i would not even bother getting behind the wheel of one, cause 1. I will never ever buy another fwd car, 2 i wouldn't drive a car that looks like my nan's hand me down and 3 well its just bloody ugly, fast or not its bloody ugly :D

Sorry i'm sure you like your car, but there is no way i would ever convert into a MAZDA MPS3 fan. I guess thats why they have dedicated mazda forums ;)

[Rhino]

You are = You're
Your = possesive



Your = possessive pronouns showing ownership ;) sorry

Um, does possessive not mean it implies or shows ownership?

You caught me out how?

[OPC]

We ain't so smart...peoples is just dumber around here :D

http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t262/aussiegman/Cletus.gif


CLASSIC......

[gman]

Um, does possessive not mean it implies or shows ownership?

You caught me out how?

i didn't or wasn't trying to catch ya... ;)

i was being pedantic and needed an avenue for my "at work boredom"....

Sorry having one of those days.... :D

[bornwild]

they dont let 17 year olds test drive sti's mate. i assume your 17 cos your a total noob when it comes to knowing anything about cars.

Ease off a bit kiddo ;)

[xplosv57]

i love this forum, you all make me laugh, cry and feel great overall!!!!

If i had to choose, id get an Astra Turbo or VXR, almost did actually, but the RWD V8 bug bit harder!!!

At the end of the day, its what youre happy with, there will always be arguments and bias everywhere depending on the situation, but at the end of the day, lets just have fun!!!!!!

Where is the LOVE!!!!

P.S. I'll pwn you all hahahaha!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Tommi]

oooooooook ..... so I opened a can of worms!! geezzs people... calm down!

I want a track car, but a car thats refined and has luxory, one with heated leather seats, fully optioned, safe for the wife to drive.. one to put around town and then on weekends to take into the hills and chase down bikes.
I've grown up with FWD's my whole life, and to be honest I have never owned a RWD/AWD and have never drifted or gone out power sliding cars... with FWD cars you learn to brake, pick a line, and control the accleration through the corner so you don't get understeer plow off the road or get the back out that far its going to spin!

So yeh VXR or MP3s(?) I think
however maybe I need to learn rwd... rx8.. mx5 turbo or...

[lampshade]

Picking up on a couple of things you say you want.

Track use
Safe for the wife to drive
Drive around town and fast road use

I would say go and test a Wrx, you wont get all of the above from a Vxr or Mp3S

[Vectracious]

Picking up on a couple of things you say you want.

Track use
Safe for the wife to drive
Drive around town and fast road use

I would say go and test a Wrx, you wont get all of the above from a Vxr or Mp3S

Yes, a WRX is good fior all those things but fails dismally in all the other criteria - the interior is old tech and quite frankly shit, the car itself is unrefined, its small and cramped, and not much of a looker. It sounds like Tommi wants more of a luxury performance car. A WRX is a shopping trolley with a turbo and 4WD system in it...

[Shaun]

Yes, a WRX is good fior all those things but fails dismally in all the other criteria - the interior is old tech and quite frankly shit, the car itself is unrefined, its small and cramped, and not much of a looker. It sounds like Tommi wants more of a luxury performance car. A WRX is a shopping trolley with a turbo and 4WD system in it...

HEHE A shopping trolley ..... thats one i havent heard of before for a WRX

[Vectracious]

HEHE A shopping trolley ..... thats one i havent heard of before for a WRX

well its true - take mine for example - apart from proper front seats, climate control, 17s and the rev's in the centre of the dash, its the same Impreza that most grandmothers drive to Chadstone and back.

I couldn't give a shit though, because it puts a smile on my face every time I get behind the wheel, especially in the wet ;)

[lampshade]

Just thought of a car which ticks all of the above.... BMW M5:p

but seriously what car does match Tommi's needs:confused: luxurious and track use, something safe for the wife to drive and good in trafic aswell as open roads, interesting dilema:cool:

[Vectracious]

Just thought of a car which ticks all of the above.... BMW M5:p


It does fit the bill doesnt it.... got a spare $230K? ;) :p Maybe we can all chip in and share it for 1 day a week each!

Also the MY08 WRX might fit the bill moreso than the current model. Looks crap on the outside, but hopefully Subaru have made some progress in refinement...

[lampshade]

Fully loaded Audi S3, there you go problem sorted;)

[Shaun]

well its true - take mine for example - apart from proper front seats, climate control, 17s and the rev's in the centre of the dash, its the same Impreza that most grandmothers drive to Chadstone and back.

I couldn't give a shit though, because it puts a smile on my face every time I get behind the wheel, especially in the wet ;)

Thats all that matters. My Sister BF is going to Buy a WRX... He said the same things after going in the VXR. He said what do you get with a WRX. AWD but no comfit. But as i said to him and he agrees. there heritage is going fast and basic.

[aussie_in_london]

Audi RS4 would be my recommendation if costs permit : )

[Shaun]

Ausi RS4 would be my recommendation if costs permit : )

2nd that....

[OZChris]

oooooooook ..... so I opened a can of worms!! geezzs people... calm down!

I want a track car, but a car thats refined and has luxory, one with heated leather seats, fully optioned, safe for the wife to drive.. one to put around town and then on weekends to take into the hills and chase down bikes.
I've grown up with FWD's my whole life, and to be honest I have never owned a RWD/AWD and have never drifted or gone out power sliding cars... with FWD cars you learn to brake, pick a line, and control the accleration through the corner so you don't get understeer plow off the road or get the back out that far its going to spin!

So yeh VXR or MP3s(?) I think
however maybe I need to learn rwd... rx8.. mx5 turbo or...

Again just my 20 cents, I'd go with a 6 MPS ; then again I'm biased :D

[dug74]

Again just my 20 cents, I'd go with a 6 MPS ; then again I'm biased :D

Maybe bias...as i am too..

But seriously...the MPS6 has the performance and luxury...also easy to drive for the laydees...

Styling isnt ..WOW LOOK AT ME...but as said...neither is the WRX.

It has all the creature comforts you could want...and can fit a family with ease.

Going rather cheap..if you can still find a 06 plated model...

But...if the money was no problem...i would definately take the Audi.

I also agree....that the VXR and MPS3 isnt the car you want...for both track, luxury and everyday driving...

Cheers
DUG74

[Wraith]

oooooooook ..... so I opened a can of worms!! geezzs people... calm down!

I want a track car, but a car thats refined and has luxory, one with heated leather seats, fully optioned, safe for the wife to drive.. one to put around town and then on weekends to take into the hills and chase down bikes.
I've grown up with FWD's my whole life, and to be honest I have never owned a RWD/AWD and have never drifted or gone out power sliding cars... with FWD cars you learn to brake, pick a line, and control the accleration through the corner so you don't get understeer plow off the road or get the back out that far its going to spin!

So yeh VXR or MP3s(?) I think
however maybe I need to learn rwd... rx8.. mx5 turbo or...

As others have suggested, that's an impossible blend/combination for one car to have in the 'nominated' price range you've also noted ;)

You'll have to just settle on one of the many compromised discussed types of 'your choice', or hang out and save up a few more dollars and get something that fits your above description :)

Oh, nothing hard about learning RWD, except proper handling of an LSD in the wet - fish tail heaven :D

[Jass]

As others have suggested, that's an impossible blend/combination for one car to have in the 'nominated' price range you've also noted ;)

You'll have to just settle on one of the many compromised discussed types of 'your choice', or hang out and save up a few more dollars and get something that fits your above description :)

Oh, nothing hard about learning RWD, except proper handling of an LSD in the wet - fish tail heaven :D

Personally i like the look of the Liberty 3.0R spec.B or the Liberty 2.5GT spec.B, depending on your price range. If i had a spare 70k i would go for the Liberty STI instead or Audi S3.

[Tommi]

thanks for the replies there helping out heaps, speically because you own the cars and have or have had experiance with them.

I'm still confused... this is just as hard as buying a house... and thats another thing we are looking for hmmm... I wonder if I can find one of those RV's powered by a veyron engine hehe :P

I also have a soft spot for rare cars, my corolla is one of 6000 built world wide however its dead ..but i still polish it and love it...anyhow... I'm still liking the VXR, theres something about it... its different and has potential, sure the 0-100 can be compared to late 80's cars but you have to remember jurnos driving the humble excel, some jurnos said it did the quater in 18sec some said low 14's..wrx times! who cares what their test say.. its finding that
car that best fits your purpose... be it a mini, mazda 3 or 6mps, a sss pulsar, a wrx or a vxr... and what really matters is what Vectracious said "...it puts a smile on my face every time I get behind the wheel" and thats what we all want.

By the way... M5... nah ... m6 I never said anything about 4 doors lol.
:)

[bornwild]

Personally i like the look of the Liberty 3.0R spec.B or the Liberty 2.5GT spec.B, depending on your price range. If i had a spare 70k i would go for the Liberty STI instead or Audi S3.

70k buys you a BMW 330i :D :D :D :D :D with sport pack :D :D :D :D

[CORZZA]

The VXR cleans the ford up in a straight line!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Go watch the Top Gear review on the Ford, Vauxhall & Renault

[xplosv57]

70k buys you a BMW 330i :D :D :D :D :D with sport pack :D :D :D :D

Umm maybe a 320i Sport not a 330i Sport, unless you're talking used....

Plus the 330i isn't available new anymore :( !!!!

[Charlatan]

The VXR cleans the ford up in a straight line!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


The traffic light grand prix is all that matters! Who cares about corners, I've never even seen one of those!

[OPC]

The traffic light grand prix is all that matters! Who cares about corners, I've never even seen one of those!

hahahaha classic... yep straight lines are for me and ill leave the corners for EVO's

[xplosv57]

LOL if its all about traffic light grand prix's, then i wouldn't consider any of the cars mentioned, i think a VXR is a good medium, can go okay at the lights but can also handle the twisties well!!!

My car can launch off the lights which is great, but give it a few corners and 1.4 Corsa's are pulling away from me!!!

Those are the times i regret not purchasing an Astra turbo or VXR!!!

[bornwild]

LOL if its all about traffic light grand prix's, then i wouldn't consider any of the cars mentioned, i think a VXR is a good medium, can go okay at the lights but can also handle the twisties well!!!

My car can launch off the lights which is great, but give it a few corners and 1.4 Corsa's are pulling away from me!!!

Those are the times i regret not purchasing an Astra turbo or VXR!!!

I bet that's some ship you're driving(ie. Commodore or Falcon) :p

[Wraith]

LOL if its all about traffic light grand prix's, then i wouldn't consider any of the cars mentioned, i think a VXR is a good medium, can go okay at the lights but can also handle the twisties well!!!

My car can launch off the lights which is great, but give it a few corners and 1.4 Corsa's are pulling away from me!!!

Those are the times i regret not purchasing an Astra turbo or VXR!!!

I'm sure that sweeeeet V8 growl makes up for it :D

[jim7777777]

oooooooook ..... so I opened a can of worms!! geezzs people... calm down!

I want a track car, but a car thats refined and has luxory, one with heated leather seats, fully optioned, safe for the wife to drive.. one to put around town and then on weekends to take into the hills and chase down bikes.
I've grown up with FWD's my whole life, and to be honest I have never owned a RWD/AWD and have never drifted or gone out power sliding cars... with FWD cars you learn to brake, pick a line, and control the accleration through the corner so you don't get understeer plow off the road or get the back out that far its going to spin!

So yeh VXR or MP3s(?) I think
however maybe I need to learn rwd... rx8.. mx5 turbo or...


My purchase criteria were almost the same as yours.

But I ended up spending a little bit more then 40K. (but not much more)

My criteria:


Euro-built:- Check
Track car:- Check
Refined:- Check
Luxury:- Not quite, but nearly
Heated leather:- Check
Sunroof:- Check
Safe for the Mrs:- Check
Hunts bikes:- Beats some (Up to and including R6s in the real twisties)
RWD:- At times
Manual:- Check
No older then 3yrs old:- Check

[Wraith]

My purchase criteria were almost the same as yours.

But I ended up spending a little bit more then 40K. (but not much more)

My criteria:


Euro-built:- Check
Track car:- Check
Refined:- Check
Luxury:- Not quite, but nearly
Heated leather:- Check
Sunroof:- Check
Safe for the Mrs:- Check
Hunts bikes:- Beats some (Up to and including R6s in the real twisties)
RWD:- At times
Manual:- Check
No older then 3yrs old:- Check


So what car is this that you got Jim :)

[xplosv57]

I'm sure that sweeeeet V8 growl makes up for it :D

Sure does!!! :D :D :D Can't beat the sound!!!!

By the way bornwild, yes i got a Commodore, boat anchor!!


My purchase criteria were almost the same as yours.

But I ended up spending a little bit more then 40K. (but not much more)

My criteria:


Euro-built:- Check
Track car:- Check
Refined:- Check
Luxury:- Not quite, but nearly
Heated leather:- Check
Sunroof:- Check
Safe for the Mrs:- Check
Hunts bikes:- Beats some (Up to and including R6s in the real twisties)
RWD:- At times
Manual:- Check
No older then 3yrs old:- Check

Awesome, but what kinda car is it?????

[OZChris]

My criteria:

Euro-built:- Check
Track car:- Check
Refined:- Check
Luxury:- Not quite, but nearly
Heated leather:- Check
Sunroof:- Check
Safe for the Mrs:- Check
Hunts bikes:- Beats some (Up to and including R6s in the real twisties)
RWD:- At times
Manual:- Check
No older then 3yrs old:- Check

+3 and ...

[dug74]

Audi A3...Golf R32

I have no clue..

Cheers
DUG74

[JohnBu]

Umm maybe a 320i Sport not a 330i Sport, unless you're talking used....

Plus the 330i isn't available new anymore :( !!!!

who cares when we say hello to 335i!!!! :D

[jim7777777]

An '03 Astra turbo

.
.
.
.
.
.


And a Leitch supersprint. (Lotus 7 replica)

There's just nothing in one car that can satisfy all those criteria, so I bought two. And it still worked out cheaper than some of the other options I looked at including second-hand 330, R32, S4 etc. And it costs me less to insure the two of them than the Mrs Rav4...

[dug74]

who cares when we say hello to 335i!!!! :D

Who cares when you say 135i

Same engine and power...less weight :D

Cheers
DUG74

[jim7777777]

Has the 135i been announced???

It will be interesting to see what the (inevitable) M1 looks like. That is if they don't call it an M2 if its the 3 door...

I was guessing on the 335i engine for the M1.

[bornwild]

Who cares when you say 135i

Same engine and power...less weight :D

Cheers
DUG74

About 50kg difference maybe? :confused:

[GreyRex]

Has the 135i been announced???

It will be interesting to see what the (inevitable) M1 looks like. That is if they don't call it an M2 if its the 3 door...

I was guessing on the 335i engine for the M1.

This may help...
http://www.leftlanenews.com/spied-bmw-1-series-coupe.html

[RudeOne]

I have just spent the last 15 min's reading the last 10 pages of this post, it has to be some of the funniest shit i have ever seen.

Dug don't worry too much about the Mazda bashing, there is equally as much VXR, XR5, GTI and what ever else hot hatch you could think of bashing! as long as your happy with it and it suits your needs, then you do not need anyone else to create buyers dissonance!

p.s RS4 all the WAY - in wagon style!!

or

SRT8 300c!!!! 13.4 sec qtr mile standard!

or

Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT-8

can i here anyone say pimp-pimp :)

[OPC]

no but ur boyfriend is a GIMP GIMP ;)

[xplosv57]

Has the 135i been announced???

It will be interesting to see what the (inevitable) M1 looks like. That is if they don't call it an M2 if its the 3 door...

I was guessing on the 335i engine for the M1.

Nope the 135i hasn't been announced, and i highly doubt it will make it over here, too hard to price it within the line up, although BMW have suprised us before!!! Hope it does come here, will be an absolute weapon!!!

P.S. off topic but on BMW's, we got a Z8 at work, one of only 2 in the country, what a sexy beast!!!!

[RudeOne]

no but ur boyfriend is a GIMP GIMP ;)

nah im not that lucky

[rjastra]

Nope the 135i hasn't been announced, and i highly doubt it will make it over here, too hard to price it within the line up, although BMW have suprised us before!!! Hope it does come here, will be an absolute weapon!!!

P.S. off topic but on BMW's, we got a Z8 at work, one of only 2 in the country, what a sexy beast!!!!

Aren't Z8s LHD only?

[gman]

Just as a side on this one...Was driving today and saw a Black XR5 for sale at Grawill Ford West Gosford and 2 orange XR5's for sale at the Ford/BMW dealer at Artarmon....

So if ya lookin' there they be.. ;)

[dug74]

Just as a side on this one...Was driving today and saw a Black XR5 for sale at Grawill Ford West Gosford and 2 orange XR5's for sale at the Ford/BMW dealer at Artarmon....

So if ya lookin' there they be.. ;)

Do you know how much they were going for????

Would should nice to see how much they have decreased in price...

I think they will be snapped up rather quickly as there is still a wait on new XR5...and EO XR5 attract that extra $1800.

Cheers
DUG74

[blueraven]

its the same for all the hot matches. 'supposedly' there is a wait on the XR5, the VXR, The MPS etc.

Sorry, but i have seen all 3 in dealerships (not on demo) and more than a handful of each. Which did suprise me, saw a VXR in Brain gardner for a few months, and the mazda in cannington has had a red mps for a while too.

[bornwild]

its the same for all the hot matches. 'supposedly' there is a wait on the XR5, the VXR, The MPS etc.

Sorry, but i have seen all 3 in dealerships (not on demo) and more than a handful of each. Which did suprise me, saw a VXR in Brain gardner for a few months, and the mazda in cannington has had a red mps for a while too.

Agreed. It's a bullshit marketing technique which supposedly hots up the car even more....it's lame psychology gone wrong.

[Wraith]

its the same for all the hot matches. 'supposedly' there is a wait on the XR5, the VXR, The MPS etc.

Sorry, but i have seen all 3 in dealerships (not on demo) and more than a handful of each. Which did suprise me, saw a VXR in Brain gardner for a few months, and the mazda in cannington has had a red mps for a while too.

This is true, I'm a regular at Kevin Dennis in Braebrook - that's where I've purchased my past new cars - and there are always at least 3 to 5 VXR's there at any one time and that's only one dealership, in fact 2 or 3 of them have been sitting there for ages...

Ralph D'Silva Holden in Preston always has VXR's in the showroom whenever I pass by there as does Booran Holden in Dandenong as well...

Mazda Essendon always has MPS 3's in the showroom...

And the Ford dealer on Manningham Rd. always has 1 or 2 XR5's in there, one of them looks untouched, so definitely not a demo and it's an orange one :)

[xplosv57]

I think waiting lists are for people who want certain options though, dealers have stock of cars, but there are waiting lists for options!!!

Although of course there are waiting lists of the car when they are first released or are a limited release!!!


Aren't Z8s LHD only?

Yep only LHD, the two here in OZ are LHD and are really only used for display, theyre not driven much!!!

[gman]

The black one's been there for a while i was told this evening.. The 2 orange ones not to sure about...None had prices on them though....

Might ring and ask about them..... ;)