New Barina on channel 7 news [Archive]

9th May 2006, 06:51 PM

drivers and pedestrians! pedestrians actually come out wors off if involved in accident with the NEW Holden Barina...

i was actually suggesting for my mother and her husband to take a look at it when buying new small car... i will have to advise them to stay away from it now...

bad new for holden but even worse for people who purchased them recently...

what is the resale value of daewoo kalos???

CJB

9th May 2006, 07:05 PM

Damn, I watched ten news :(

A Current Affair said the same thing a while back didnt they?

No one will really take much notice I think, until they themselves are involved in an accident.

tmov81

9th May 2006, 07:15 PM

yeah i saw it... they dont look that bad... but seriously, what do people expect from a $12-15k car (im guessing thats how much it costs)...

maloo97

9th May 2006, 07:40 PM

Yeh seen it lol ... 2 Stars in safety and 1 point for pedestrians or sumthing ... But Holdens happy with it ......................

oneightoo

9th May 2006, 07:42 PM

well as long as holden is cool with it.. hahaha

SSS_Hoon

9th May 2006, 08:28 PM

Bernard Siong

9th May 2006, 08:44 PM

was also in the paper today only reacieved 2 stars, and they recomended that holden tell ppl that buy it that it is nothing like the previous model which got 4 stars and its not even made in the same country as the old model.

like really what person would expect a car like that to be a 5 star safty rating for that price now come on ppl.

SSS_Hoon

haha yeah i saw the same thing today
that is very poor but
i havent looked into it but isnt the hyundai accent pretty good for that 14k price range? it always wins the NRMA awards

MatsHolden

9th May 2006, 09:02 PM

yeah i saw it... they dont look that bad... but seriously, what do people expect from a $12-15k car (im guessing thats how much it costs)...

The Opel sourced Barina recieved 4 Stars and it was in the $12-16k range, so people can expect relatively high safety ratings.

Dee

9th May 2006, 09:15 PM

the following information is sourced from
www.howsafeisyourcar.com.au

Holden Barina (Opel Corsa) * * * *
http://www.howsafeisyourcar.com.au/index.php?page=ancap_detail&aid=6&vid=1046

The HOLDEN BARINA CITY performed well in the offset crash test (score 13.13 out of 16). The passenger compartment held its shape well. Protection from serious leg injury was adequate for the driver. Chest protection for the passenger was marginal.

The vehicle also performed well in the side impact crash (score 14.84 out of 16).

Holden Barina (Daewoo Kalos)[/B] * * *
http://www.howsafeisyourcar.com.au/index.php?page=ancap_detail&aid=134&vid=6856

The DAEWOO KALOS scored 5.90 out of 16 in the offset crash test. The passenger compartment held its shape reasonably well in the offset crash test, except for pedal and footwell intrusion. Protection from serious lower leg injury was poor for the driver. Chest protection was marginal for the driver.

The vehicle scored 11.73 out of 16 in the side impact crash test. Protection from serious chest injury was marginal for the driver.

i think that speaks for itself

CJB

9th May 2006, 09:46 PM

The SB was a really safe car!

Mine flipped on it's side and slid - and I came out just fine!

Mr T

9th May 2006, 10:18 PM

The SB was a really safe car!

Mine flipped on it's side and slid - and I came out just fine!

Peta did the same in an SB only flipped it all the way to its roof...come out without a scratch, just a bruised ego.

I doubt Holden will be telling anyone, appart from destroying any false credibility the car has, Holden dosen't repect those ratings - hasn't since they slammed the SB (ironic ay). They claim (or claimed in the past) that they do not reflect the real world and therefore will not advertise their acheivements relating to them.

tmov81

9th May 2006, 10:30 PM

i cant help but question how the scale they are using to measure these cars...

the barina gets a 14.84/16 for side impact... but a bmw x5 scores a maximum 16/16 for side impact...

its pretty much saying that you are only 7% (diff between 14.84/16 and 16/16) safer being hit from the side in an X5 than you are in a barina... the fact that all the cars inbetween the barina and x5 are seperated by only 1.16 marks seems kinda silly and there really shouldnt be any ceiling effect in the testing where you have vehicles listed as scoring maximal scores as there is no way in discriminating between their safety levels then... i mean it is saying you are as safe in a renault megane in a side impact as you are in vw touareg which both score 16s...

they really need to upgrade the intensity of these crash tests so that we can get scores that are actually meaningful and offer us some ability to discriminate between cars...

pred8r

9th May 2006, 11:18 PM

I read somewhere that the XC was heaps stronger than the SB crash-wise.

MatsHolden

9th May 2006, 11:25 PM

tmov81

9th May 2006, 11:41 PM

Thing is it doesn't matter what car you are in if you are in a relatively high speed crash, as it doesn't matter how well the car holds up there is only so much the internal organs of the human body can take. If you have a head on at say 100km/h, whether you're in a Statesman or a Barina, you'll be seriously injured in both vehicles, if not killed.
i would take my chances in a statesman any day of the week and im sure i wouldnt be alone in that regard... the statesman would be capable of absorbing significantly more of the forces before they reach the occupants than the barina...

the threshold for survival is gonna be higher in a statesman...

oneightoo

9th May 2006, 11:45 PM

yeah thats like saying you as safe in an excel as you are in a calibra..

i'll take the bigger sedan any day..

MatsHolden

9th May 2006, 11:54 PM

Just something to ponder...

On the left is a Mini, on the right a Ford F150. Both crashed at the same speeds, I know which one i'd rather be in.
http://www.bridger.us/pictures/mini_vs_f150.jpg

CJB

9th May 2006, 11:55 PM

sorry troy and matchu, I will go with Mat on this one!

I am sure I read somewhere something about what you're saying, about the impact still producing the same consequences regardless of the size of the car.

The XC has a stronger feel to it. I don't know how to explain it, because a general "feeling" doesnt mean jack, but it just does - I think the design seems sturdier, and the XC is slightly bigger then the SB.

I am told, bigger cars make people feel safer, but they are easier to lose control of, and can cause greater harm in an accident.

oneightoo

9th May 2006, 11:57 PM

well a ford f150 isnt a sedan, and what we were comparing was a sedan to a small car..

CJB

10th May 2006, 12:01 AM

all the cars though these days are designed to crumple.

when I got rear ended last year, my bumper just popped back out.

The bigger cars are the same, smaller cars are the same - all designed to crumple to absorb impact.

Im not making any sense now. I best stop posting :p

MatsHolden

10th May 2006, 12:01 AM

I was just using Statesman as an example of a large vehicle. Should have just said large vehicle and small vehicle.

oneightoo

10th May 2006, 12:05 AM

lol the f150 doesnt look that bad.. imagine the whiplash in the mini tho..

MatsHolden

10th May 2006, 12:09 AM

hahaha, not too bad? The occupant has been thrown underneath the dash, and has their legs bent up towards their chest. I think I prefer whiplash. lol

CJB

10th May 2006, 12:09 AM

At the end of the day, so long as you and the passengers survive without too much harm, what does it matter?

the thing is, how many accidents have u seen where people just get out and u think to yourself "How did they do that"?

I know my accident the Police said they expected at least one, if not both of us to be hospitalised.

This where I think a little thing called fate steps in.

Cos without sounding harsh, some accidents u think, how could that cause a fatality?

MatsHolden

10th May 2006, 12:11 AM

tmov81

10th May 2006, 12:15 AM

i wont dispute big cars are shyte... bmw x5 would be much better to be in an accident in if you were sitting at traffic lights and someone ran into you while you were stationary... but if you are going around a corner and someone t-bones you you dont wanna be in that because of the high center of gravity.

other thing with those crash tests is the cars are smashed into an immovable object. so the greater the mass of the vehicle the greater damage it will inflict on itself. however if that ford f150 smashed into the mini, the damage would be different. and the structural damage to the interior/exterior of the vehicles would not be as deadly as the extent to which the body is thrown around within the vehicle.

the other thing is the f150 is a pretty primitive piece of equipment... you are comparing an american pick up truck designed before the era of airbags, abs, crumple zones, etc etc to a BMW. Its pretty well known that european standards for crash safety are traditionally higher than that of the americas or asia.

the issue with vehicle size comes back to basic physics... force = mass x acceleration. a bigger vehicle will generally have more room to crumple, decreasing the rate of acceleration and subsequent force... additionally if a heavier object hits a lighter object, the lighter object has less inertia so it is going to bare the brunt of the force...

obviously safety features and design have improved significantly, but if you take a mini and smash it into a bmw 740Li, two cars from the same company and so similar considerations of safety (to a greater extent than you would get comparing it to a US designed pick up truck), you would have to favour being in the 740Li than in the mini... there is just significantly greater capacity of the 740Li to absorb the impact due to the greater distance between the first point of contact (front of vehicle) and the occupants...

MatsHolden

10th May 2006, 12:22 AM

Fair points. Don't care what car i'm in, i just don't want to have a crash at 100km/h or more. lol

tmov81

10th May 2006, 12:23 AM

heres a visual for you...

http://i3.tinypic.com/xly2aw.jpg

i havent posted the reverse angle after they pulled the car away from the truck because they are pretty gruesome

CJB

10th May 2006, 12:24 AM

Fair points. Don't care what car i'm in, i just don't want to have a crash at 100km/h or more. lol

I was doing 110km easily when I went off the highway!

I shut my eyes, it's sooo scary. I had nightmares for ages after, and it took me a good 2 years to get comfortable driving on dark country roads again.

No one wants it to happen to them. And I wouldnt wish it upon anyone!

MatsHolden

10th May 2006, 12:30 AM

heres a visual for you...

http://i3.tinypic.com/xly2aw.jpg

i havent posted the reverse angle after they pulled the car away from the truck because they are pretty gruesome

Haha thats a Semi trailer, I want to see a photo of large vehicle (that you can drive with a normal drivers license) vs a small car. I know what trucks can do to cars, I was a member of the CFA for 2 years, had many shocking callouts like that.

tmov81

10th May 2006, 12:45 AM

assuming the design is of the same standard between vehicles, and they are both head on, the damage is going to be split based on the weight of the vehicles...

so BMW 760Li = 2680kg
versus
Mini Cooper = 1075kg

there is 3755kg between both vehicles, the cooper is gonna take 71% of the damage and the 760Li is gonna take 29% of the damage. yeah its an overly basic generalisation, and cars with greater capacity to dissipate force through longer/larger crumple zones will decrease the transfer of that force to the occupants... there are so many factors to throw in, mainly what is going to allow the vehicle to slow down less rapidly (ie crumple zones, spinning rather than absorbing the impact directly, angle of impact, point of contact, centre of gravity, etc etc)...

Dave

10th May 2006, 02:59 AM

I agree about the new barina's and astra's, I was at a car yard tonight because i spoted 2 OPEL sriT's for sale one black one blue and i want ne realy bad but i cant affored it lol.

As it turned out there were the new astra's and barina's sitting there, i had a close look at both and the build quality is apauling compared to the OPELS, they look cheap nasty and tacky. I was scared that if i sat in it the plastic might break, it looked crap and cheap. I'll take a 2nd hand opel over a new daewoo any day.

And as for crispy rolling his opel barina, i have rolled my opel astra as well and walked away without a scratch, AT ALL. It was a pretty serius accident, ill post some pics if youd like.

Gimme an opel any day :) i trust there build quality to save me in the event of an accident. After all what speeds are they built to do over there in germany ? :o

Red AH SRI T

10th May 2006, 07:57 AM

Holden's stance on this is that it says safetey can not be measured by one of crash test that in most situations don't replicate real world situations.

It says the Barina far exceedes all safety standards in all 95 countries that it is sold in.

Red AH SRI T

10th May 2006, 10:13 AM

All Holden vehicles meet or exceed strict Australian and safety standards - including Holden Barina.
Barina is part of a family of vehicles that has sold around 800,000 units in 95 countries since 2002. It meets or exceeds the legislated safety requirements in every one of those 95 countries including Australia, parts of Europe and the US.
At Holden, we do not allow a single test on one vehicle to determine its crashworthiness or overall safety. Instead, we put vehicles through some of the most stringent crash testing in the world and often these tests far exceed legal requirements.
Our internal crash testing procedures, in many cases, are the benchmark for the entire automotive industry. Many safety features in the world's vehicles today are the result of the GM researchers and engineers.
The Barina is a safe vehicle as reflected by the excellent track record of crashworthiness of vehicles on roads around the world since the vehicle was launched four years ago. It has a comprehensive safety feature list with standard or optional features including driver and front passenger airbags, four channel ABS with electronic brake distribution and seat belt pretensioners

CJB

10th May 2006, 10:21 AM

Is Holden forcing you to say that? :eek:

:confused:

tmov81

10th May 2006, 12:41 PM

Is Holden forcing you to say that? :eek:

:confused:
HAHAHAHA :D

but its true to an extent, i mean the testing procedure they use to get those scores to me seems to consist of two tests and that is it... the fact they cannot tell the difference between a renault megane and VW touareg in a side impact is pretty shyte...

Obviously holden would say all their vehicles are fantastic... admitting to any less is setting themself up for a pounding (but then when they stop selling them they put **** on them because they CBF'd providing parts/assistance for them anymore).

So yeah, while the two tests we have scores for are pretty useless they are better than nothing. Are the test results from the internal holden testing available? Because I mean if they arent making that information publically available they are just being car salespeople and feeding us BS... I am not going to take the word of holden who i consider to be one of the leaders of propaganda and baloney in this country...

seriously... "holden means a great deal to australians" and trying to constantly sell the BS story to the bogans that "holdens are a 'stralyan car"... i am really sick of them trying to sell us the crap that they actually give a flying pigs a$$. hmmm back to work now :)

pred8r

11th May 2006, 12:53 AM

One of the main differences in a bingle would be ride height. I would no way like to be in a lowered mini if i get hit by a raised F150 (or in any other 'higher' vehicle) and have it come through my window, instead of hitting square on the side.

p.s. Can anyone explain why trucks bumpers are so high from the ground? They dont go 4wd-ing. If they were, say, 15cm from the ground you would ASSUME that in an accident the impact would be spread on the whole section of the car, unlike the pic earlier where it probably went over the bonnet and squashed the car under as the truck tried to ride up and over the top.

Dave

11th May 2006, 04:57 AM

haha, you sound like your trying to sell it, oh wait isnt that the idea? :P

No insult's are directed at you, just holden.

Ive got a new name for holden. HOLDEN OVERSEAS IMPORTERS

You wanna know something realy sad ?

To bad im gonna tell ya, I didnt know holden didnt build there own cars untill i got my first astra and realized it was a NISSAN PULSAR with a badge change. HEH

I gues there propaganda works when you dont pay that much attenton to em.

But at the end of the day, If the cars they import are of a high quality and standard, I dont mind. But id prefer it to be sold as the viechel it is and not a rebadged DAEWOO. Thats a kick in the pants, calling a daewoo a holden, or a nissan for that matter.

The last true aussie built holden was something like a 85 VK?

Please correct me if im wrong, I know the torrana's were built in aus,
Im just curius to know.

Red AH SRI T

11th May 2006, 07:45 AM

ummm, incase you didn't notice the whole commodore range is built here in Aus, and so was the Vectra for a while.

And in reply to tmov81, there is not a single car manurfacturer in the whole entire world that publicly releases their internal crash test a nd safety data.

tmov81

11th May 2006, 09:40 AM

And in reply to tmov81, there is not a single car manurfacturer in the whole entire world that publicly releases their internal crash test a nd safety data.
what is the use of telling us how wonderfully the 'holdens' perform and how rigorous the testing is if it isnt supported with any evidence...

its about as good as a used car salesman telling me a used car they are selling has a new engine or new gearbox and not giving me any receipts to prove it...

oh and i am australian and holden doesnt mean a great deal to me... can you tell them to stop lying in their commercial :p

agree with pred8r... the pic with the truck and seát shows the prob with trucks and other vehicles which have ridiculously high ground clearance...

MatsHolden

11th May 2006, 12:22 PM

Ive got a new name for holden. HOLDEN OVERSEAS IMPORTERS

As Black AH CDX said, the Commodore is an Australian made car, and the Vectra for Australia was built at the Elizabeth plant in SA for a short while. Where do you think Ford Australia get their Focus, Fiesta, Explorer etc. from? Overseas of course.

Red AH SRI T

11th May 2006, 04:34 PM

what is the use of telling us how wonderfully the 'holdens' perform and how rigorous the testing is if it isnt supported with any evidence...

its about as good as a used car salesman telling me a used car they are selling has a new engine or new gearbox and not giving me any receipts to prove it...

oh and i am australian and holden doesnt mean a great deal to me... can you tell them to stop lying in their commercial :p

agree with pred8r... the pic with the truck and seát shows the prob with trucks and other vehicles which have ridiculously high ground clearance...

I think its time we stop attacking Holden here.

They aren't the only company doing this.

as i stated before: NOT A SINGLE CAR MANURFACTURER IN THE WHOLE WORLD RELEASES THEIR OWN CRASH TEST SAFTEY DATA TO THE PUBLIC.

All of this Saftey star rating stuff comes from independent bodies, who crash 1 single car in a lab and score it, this does not represent real world conditions.
There are marques that make their cars just to pass these tests, slamming a car into a wall is not the same as two cars crashing in to each other.

How can u rate how well a car tests after crashing one car once?

Thats baloney.

BTW, im not sayin that the new Barina is a good car :p

MatsHolden

11th May 2006, 04:45 PM

Yes, that's right, there are so many variables in real world scenarios that just can't be simulated in a controlled environment.

tmov81

11th May 2006, 06:51 PM

I think its time we stop attacking Holden here.

They aren't the only company doing this.

as i stated before: NOT A SINGLE CAR MANURFACTURER IN THE WHOLE WORLD RELEASES THEIR OWN CRASH TEST SAFTEY DATA TO THE PUBLIC.

All of this Saftey star rating stuff comes from independent bodies, who crash 1 single car in a lab and score it, this does not represent real world conditions.
There are marques that make their cars just to pass these tests, slamming a car into a wall is not the same as two cars crashing in to each other.

How can u rate how well a car tests after crashing one car once?

Thats baloney.

BTW, im not sayin that the new Barina is a good car :p
im not attacking holden for the crash testing...

just saying its no good hearing how wonderfully they go in private tests if they arent going to give the results then its a waste of breath.

Getting the result of 1 test is better than getting told they did hundreds of tests and not getting any data from those hundreds of tests.

but i am attacking holden for their current advertising campaign :p where they claim to mean a great deal to me, when really they dont give a $#!t about me so why should i give a $#!T about them?

Red AH SRI T

12th May 2006, 07:42 AM

would you like them to come and make you a cup of tea and give you a foot rub?

12th May 2006, 09:54 AM

at the end of it... its a free world and thank goodness for freedom of speech and media... now people can make up their own mind as to the product in question (Holden Barina\Kalos)

some will still buy it, despite the worrying crash tests, because thats all they can afford...others will think twice and seek different model\brand of a car if their budget allows.

tmov81

12th May 2006, 10:40 AM

would you like them to come and make you a cup of tea and give you a foot rub?
hahaha i would like them to make calibra parts readily available so i dont have to deal with frigging saab when i want a 3rd gear and 5th gear synchro...

also when i need synchro guides i would like it if when i asked for them (there are three per gear) and holden tells me they only have 4, but they come in packs of 5 so i have to wait for them to order one from europe before they will sell it they would use some common sense...

oh it would also be nice if i didnt have to listen to the spares person groan every time i mention the word calibra and also when i first bought the calibra and went into holden the first time, it would be nice if they didnt tell me it was a crap car...

but holden means a great deal to australians (searches for vomit bag :p)