HSV Announce four cylinder programme gets green light

[Shaun]

Just reading the HSV Web site tonight and found an article that the VXR has been Officially Give the Green Light.

http://www.hsv.com.au/index_new.asp

Look out GTi owners. HSV are about to unleash a car that will make the GTi look like a luke warm hatch.

[MatsHolden]

Yeh I saw that too!! Great news, can't wait to see them out here. And for under $43000... awesome.:D

[Shaun]

Off to dealer land as soon as a price is set in stone. Goodbye SRi T hello HSV VXR.

[MatsHolden]

Yeh I reckon it'll take some buyer's away from the yet to be released Astra Coupe SRi Turbo considering spend around another $7000 and you can have the VXR with a whole lot more looks and grunt!

[Shaun]

I was refering to my SRi T But you are correct about that. but if you read the press article the VXR will be in Limited Number for 2006. Maybe some deal between HSV and Holden has about import for the 1st year is capped.

[EL BURITO]

probly something to do with the fact that they are still trying to keep uo with the demand in the UK

[AF1R]

Look out GTi owners. HSV are about to unleash a car that will make the GTi look like a luke warm hatch.

I dunno about that man.
Got this video where a Golf GTI auto DGS vs a Opel Astra manual (didnt say if it was a VRX, but they said the Astra had the advantage in "P.W.R" power weight ratio)
Astra got beat.

[MatsHolden]

I dunno about that man.
Got this video where a Golf GTI auto DGS vs a Opel Astra manual (didnt say if it was a VRX, but they said the Astra had the advantage in "P.W.R" power weight ratio)
Astra got beat.

I doubt it was a VXR mate, as the VXR has 176kw compared with Golf GTi's 147kw. It may have been an Astra Turbo SRi.

[pred8r]

maybe HSV are bringing in a small number initially as a trial to see what press/consumer reaction and takeup is like.


how well did the sv1800 sell?

[Red AH SRI T]

how can u compare the VXR to the SV1800?

[MatsHolden]

how can u compare the VXR to the SV1800?

Very good point! There is no comparrison lol. VXR wins hands down.
It wasn't even an Opel, it was a Nissan.
79kw vs 176kw

[Shaun]

how can u compare the VXR to the SV1800?
Well put Kurt. You cant compare them. In the day of the SV1800 the market wasnt there for the "Hot Hatch or Hot Fours" . Now there is a market for them to compete in. Look at the Popularity of the Volkswagen Golf GTi. They have a waiting list for deliverys.

I predict that the VXR will sell well. Its Europes answer to a WRX.

[Shaun]

I dunno about that man.
Got this video where a Golf GTI auto DGS vs a Opel Astra manual (didnt say if it was a VRX, but they said the Astra had the advantage in "P.W.R" power weight ratio)
Astra got beat.

I have seen a straight line test on top gear and the VXR leaves the Golf (Both in Stock trim) for dead. Has about 2 -3 car gap over the GTi.

[180HOA]

I agree with Pred that HSV will probably be cautious at first with the VXR... The VXR is a very different direction for HSV, so they're going to want to make sure it doesn't upset existing HSV owners, for starters. Add to that the possibility that HSV would lack credibility with a lot of the people who'd buy a car like the VXR - which is their own fault because a lot of people still have memories of HSV atrocities like the SV1800 and that Jackaroo thing they did. Things llike that just left the impression that HSV have no interest in cars that don't start life on a Commodore production line.

It may be a brilliant car, but whether it succeeds will probably have a lot to do with whether HSV take it seriously themselves this time.

[Shaun]

I agree with Pred that HSV will probably be cautious at first with the VXR... The VXR is a very different direction for HSV, so they're going to want to make sure it doesn't upset existing HSV owners, for starters. Add to that the possibility that HSV would lack credibility with a lot of the people who'd buy a car like the VXR - which is their own fault because a lot of people still have memories of HSV atrocities like the SV1800 and that Jackaroo thing they did. Things llike that just left the impression that HSV have no interest in cars that don't start life on a Commodore production line.

It may be a brilliant car, but whether it succeeds will probably have a lot to do with whether HSV take it seriously themselves this time.

HSV's Managing Director Phil Harding sums it up well in the press release on the HSV site.Im sure HSV have done there market research. Lets face it the Market wants Hot Hatches look at the waiting list for a GTi Golf atm. HSV wouldnt have added it to there line up if they didnt think it could sell or has the Protential to be a class leader (IMO i think the car will be the leader in the Hot Hatch in the Australia.). HSV have followed the car for sometime right through the developement stages . The VXR /OPC has taken the Europe by storm with order banks up to 5 month in the UK.
I have have been looking at this car from the 1st day i seen an article in the Sydney's Saturday Daily Telegraph over 18 months ago.The VXR has an appeal to people because it is not of the normal Hot Hatch look with Its agressive looks which makes the VXR stand out above and beyond the crowd in all aspects but also has the powe to back up the looks.The car fits the HSV core values. This car will sell, May not sell in Huge Volumes like other HSV products which is rightly so but there will be a market for this car. I for one will be purchasing a VXR. (when im ready too ) and i cant wait to go for a run in one in June while im London on Holidays. Every review for the press and thoses that have purchased a VXR has been positive.

HSV have a true Hot Hatch in the VXR and from reading the press release on the HSV web site it seems there are more exciting products to come from HSV in the future.

[pred8r]

I agree with Pred that HSV will probably be cautious at first with the VXR... The VXR is a very different direction for HSV, so they're going to want to make sure it doesn't upset existing HSV owners, for starters. Add to that the possibility that HSV would lack credibility with a lot of the people who'd buy a car like the VXR - which is their own fault because a lot of people still have memories of HSV atrocities like the SV1800 and that Jackaroo thing they did. Things llike that just left the impression that HSV have no interest in cars that don't start life on a Commodore production line.

It may be a brilliant car, but whether it succeeds will probably have a lot to do with whether HSV take it seriously themselves this time.
Thank you for someone who saw behind the car specs and to the business end of it.

One other thing HSV will be gauging, and this could cause the dropping of the VXR, is the why would i drop $80k on a Commodore HSV when its slower than a $40k Astra HSV?
If they start pulling too much money out of their bread and butter market they may get dropped. They make more money retrimming commodores (because of the V8 POWAAAH mentality) than rebadging astras - or maybe not.

[MatsHolden]

The HSV VXR won't be quicker than the V8 powered commodore based HSV's, so I think that their big sellers will continue to be just that. Also if the VXR Astra's are only brought in in limited numbers then they wouldn't be pulling too much away from the sales of their Commodore V8 range.

[Red AH SRI T]

people who buy an Astra VXR aren't the type of people who would buy a commodore based HSV


We aren't bogans for starters......sheesh!!!!

[SSS_Hoon]

Well well well, from what i have heard read and seen the VXR we get here will not be the same as the UK version. Where as the GTi is the same as the Euro version in every which way no need for VW Aus to change it or make it look more appealing to the Aus market by adding some bogan :lol: badges and writing.

As for the videos, well the top gear one you can forget about it as the top gear guys prefered the GTi overall, and i think they had the man GTi not the DSG which is half a sec faster, and they dont know how to drive the best either. There is a few vids getting around with the GTi doing the 0-100 in 6sec flat factory claimed 6.9sec for the DSG. The other one is with highly renowned Jap drift and race car drivers driving them against the astra turbo it dont look like the vxr but hard to tell, the megane the GTi beat them both with the GTi doing the 0-400m in 15.0 and at the end a 14.7 for a stock GTi now i dont see a stock astra of any shape or form doing those numbers.

And for the KW Junkies out there that keep saying well the VXR has 170kw and the golf only has 147kw well that means crap all our GTi made a 126fwkw stock as, which is only a 21kw drop from claimed factory power output and i know that the current SRiT make no where near 126fwkw in stock form or even some modded ones too. And i doubt the VXR will only have a 20 odd Kw drop from the 170kw claimed factory output. The VXR runs max boost of 1.2bar for 170kw the GTi runs max boost of about .6 to .8 bar for 147kw and a reflash takes that to 1bar and 180oddKw mark and 411Nm(claimed from flash company).The VXR will most likely be ahrd to tune like the curent SRIT.The GTi uses less fuel too VXR combined of 9.3L-100k the GTi is 8.0L-100k.VXR 223g/Km C02 emissioons, GTi 192. and the GTi is 50kg lighter too (based on uk VXR specs) ours will most likely be heavier as HSV add all the stuff to it and i think they even get rid of the lotus suspension dont they?

And Shaun as you know and Mr and Mrs T know also that the stock GTi holds its own against modded SRiT's and leaves stock SRiT's in its wake.

But in the end its upto the individual to decide which car is for them and this being a opel site we know what that is dont we :lol: but for me its the GTi for sure but yeah im most likely biased as we have a GTi, and the majority of ppl on here are biased towards the Opel and that is sweet each to their own, but a bit of kind hearted rivalry never goes astray now does it.


That is just my 2cents(more like a dollar)

let the flames begin :lol:


SSS_Hoon

[pred8r]

people who buy an Astra VXR aren't the type of people who would buy a commodore based HSV


We aren't bogans for starters......sheesh!!!!
You're saying im not 'people'? Id happily own both, although itd be a Stato base not Commy :D (cant afford to own both though)

apart from that its got a HSV badge.

[MatsHolden]

I agree pred8r, to say that all HSV V8 owners are bogan's and wouldn't be the type of people that would consider the VXR is a bit of a narrowminded stereotype. I'd happily drive either one.:D

[180HOA]

Well well well, from what i have heard read and seen the VXR we get here will not be the same as the UK version. Where as the GTi is the same as the Euro version in every which way no need for VW Aus to change it or make it look more appealing to the Aus market by adding some bogan :lol: badges and writing.

Personally I think the reason for the VXR ending up a HSV probably had more to do with the Holden badge not holding enough value to sell a $45k astra, than it did with any attempt to Ozzify the car... Especially when you can get a Viva drive-away for about $18k - they aren't really cars that belong in the same brand.


And Shaun as you know and Mr and Mrs T know also that the stock GTi holds its own against modded SRiT's and leaves stock SRiT's in its wake.

I'd like to think so - seeings that when new the SRiT's cost about $10k less than a (roughly) equivalently specified GTi does now. Add the fact the SRiT's are now a couple of years old and worth nearly half as much as it costs to buy a GTi - I'd expect the GTi to be better (though I'm really not a fan of the DSG - I'd be going for the manual).


But in the end its upto the individual to decide which car is for them

Agreed on that one. It doesn't matter what you buy - within about a year there's probably gonna be something else out that's newer/faster/trendier. I wouldn't mind a GTi, but for now the SRiT continues to be a good thing. It's still good fun and having copped the worst of the depreciation, I'm not yet ready to fork out an extra $20k so I might be able to get to 100km/h a fraction of a second faster... But by the time I'm looking to upgrade, the GTi will probably be old news and there'll be something else in the limelight... maybe the VXR, maybe something else again. In the end you gotta buy it cos you like it - not just because its the 'best' in the eyes of other people. If you're gonna get upset the first time something 'better' pulls up beside you at the traffic lights, you're not gonna be happy for very long...

[SSS_Hoon]

Personally I think the reason for the VXR ending up a HSV probably had more to do with the Holden badge not holding enough value to sell a $45k astra, than it did with any attempt to Ozzify the car... Especially when you can get a Viva drive-away for about $18k - they aren't really cars that belong in the same brand.

Your most likely right with that point there i didnt think of it that way.I still think that it has a bit to dop with the fact that the last turbo astra didnt sell all that well at all and holden thought that by putting a HSV badge on it will make it sell more.


I'd like to think so - seeings that when new the SRiT's cost about $10k less than a (roughly) equivalently specified GTi does now. Add the fact the SRiT's are now a couple of years old and worth nearly half as much as it costs to buy a GTi - I'd expect the GTi to be better (though I'm really not a fan of the DSG - I'd be going for the manual).

yeah but your missing my point which was stock for stock the GTi is better then the SRiT was or is. But i will say this about the SRiT i like the looks of that better then the VXR.

As for the DSG i was the same when i first heard about it, and knowing my GF cannot drive a manual and its her car that she would get the DSG being a auto of sorts, that was until i drove it, on the test drive i took it out the dealer wasnt with us and it was only a short drive and i was hooked on it, it changes so damm qwik i would say qwiker then any manual can shift no matter who is doing the shifting, and its so smooth and keeps it in the right rev range the entire time its great. The DSG is that qwik that it keeps up with MR n MRS T SRiT until 3rd gear which is were they pull away from us and thier car does a 14.0, if we got a better launch i think it would be a bit longer before they caught us.




Agreed on that one. It doesn't matter what you buy - within about a year there's probably gonna be something else out that's newer/faster/trendier. I wouldn't mind a GTi, but for now the SRiT continues to be a good thing. It's still good fun and having copped the worst of the depreciation, I'm not yet ready to fork out an extra $20k so I might be able to get to 100km/h a fraction of a second faster... But by the time I'm looking to upgrade, the GTi will probably be old news and there'll be something else in the limelight... maybe the VXR, maybe something else again. In the end you gotta buy it cos you like it - not just because its the 'best' in the eyes of other people. If you're gonna get upset the first time something 'better' pulls up beside you at the traffic lights, you're not gonna be happy for very long...


Hell yeah and it dont even take a year for it to be old news these days, look there is the VXR, the XR5, the new volvo, the nissan concept(wont get of the ground though) and even the new mps sp23 mazda too.its all about personal preference and you cannot knock or bag someone bcoz of this choice.



SSS_Hoon

[180HOA]

You don;t find the takeoff with the DSG annoying? My folks have a TDi with the DSG and while I admit it's brilliant on the move, the delay on takeoff is enough to put me off. If they could build in some torque-converter sort of arrangement for first gear, so you don't have that pause after you take your foot off the brake before the clutch is properly engaged, I think it'd just about be perfect.

[SSS_Hoon]

You don;t find the takeoff with the DSG annoying? My folks have a TDi with the DSG and while I admit it's brilliant on the move, the delay on takeoff is enough to put me off. If they could build in some torque-converter sort of arrangement for first gear, so you don't have that pause after you take your foot off the brake before the clutch is properly engaged, I think it'd just about be perfect.


that aint the problem, its the drive by wire setup that they have, if the brake is engaged for longer then 3 secs then the throttle is disengaged, to overcome it you have to take your foot of the brake about a sec or two before you want to take off and its fine.

or it could be the fact its a TDi?


SSS_Hoon

[180HOA]

I don't think it's to do with the engine or the throttle. I think it just comes down to the fact that the thing is in neutral until you take your foot off the brake, at which point the clutch begins to engage. Until the clutch is fully engaged all you get by giving it gas is lots of revs and no forward progress. By comparison, in a regular manual you can anticipate exactly when you want to take off and release the clutch as you release the brake. With the DSG you've gotta release the brake completely - and only then does the clutch start to engage; you can't take your foot off the brake till you're ready to move, because it'll start to creep, but at the same time, when you are ready to move and you take your foot off the brake you have to wait for the clutch to catch up before you can gun it. It drives me batty in stop-start situations. I know the thing is probably faster to 100km and 400m than a standard manual where it could be tested within a controlled situation, but I'm not so sure whether it'd be any faster in a lot of real world scenarios. Even if the manual were a touch slower in the real world, I'd still opt that way, because the more I drive it the more I hate the vague feeling of the DSG at takeoff. For me it's a real dissapointment in what is an otherwise hard to fault car.

[SSS_Hoon]

we dont get that problem at all with lots of revs and no movement we get lots of revs and ltos of wheel spin though.maybe were just used to it or something, i do know that there is a slight delay but not that much at all really.

maybe get vw too look at it.


the only thing i dont like about is the fact that you cannot tell it what gear you want it to go into if it thinks that that gear is no good, like you cannot take off in 2nd gear.


SSS_Hoon

[180HOA]

Well it's not no movement exactly, just a fair bit of clutch slip if you gun it too hard too soon. Perhaps the DSG's in the GTi's are calibrated a little more aggressively than those in the TDi's?

[Shaun]

Look no one is saying the GTI is worse then the HSV VXR. The VXR is going to be on the same level as the R32 Golf powerwise but will be about 15k cheaper from what im hearing. As for Spec the VXR will be the same Spec as the Vauxhall version with Minor changes to make the car Unquie to HSV.

The R32 Golf was tested at a race track and the VXR was actually Quicker. Ill find a link for you guys.

[WindeX]

Look no one is saying the GTI is worse then the HSV VXR. The VXR is going to be on the same level as the R32 Golf powerwise but will be about 15k cheaper from what im hearing. As for Spec the VXR will be the same Spec as the Vauxhall version with Minor changes to make the car Unquie to HSV.

The R32 Golf was tested at a race track and the VXR was actually Quicker. Ill find a like for you guys.

Really? Thats bloody awesome, I love R32s sexiest production golf ever.

[BA55UP]

this means the SRI-T's will drop in price :P maybe i will be able to afford one soon :D

[01CDsedan]

Well put Kurt. You cant compare them. In the day of the SV1800 the market wasnt there for the "Hot Hatch or Hot Fours".

The market was there - the Swift GTi and Corolla Twin Cam spring to mind - but the SV1800 really wasn't up to it against its competitors.

[pred8r]

OT - is DSG the same/similar as the semi-auto clutch in the citroen?

[180HOA]

OT - is DSG the same/similar as the semi-auto clutch in the citroen?

Yeah but no but yeah...

Conceptually, the DSG is like two gearboxes and two electronically controlled clutches. One box for 1st, 3rd and 5th; the other for 2nd, 4th and 6th. This makes for the split-second gear changes: while you're in 2nd and accelerating, 3rd gear is already selected by the 'other' gearbox. The clutch for 3rd gear is engaged almost simultaneously as the clutch for 2nd is disengaged. So simple but so clever...

[Shaun]

The market was there - the Swift GTi and Corolla Twin Cam spring to mind - but the SV1800 really wasn't up to it against its competitors.
Not like the market is today . The Smaller car market today for car manafactures in general is increased in the last 10 years. Not just in the Hot hatch game.

[Shaun]

Yeah but no but yeah...

Conceptually, the DSG is like two gearboxes and two electronically controlled clutches. One box for 1st, 3rd and 5th; the other for 2nd, 4th and 6th. This makes for the split-second gear changes: while you're in 2nd and accelerating, 3rd gear is already selected by the 'other' gearbox. The clutch for 3rd gear is engaged almost simultaneously as the clutch for 2nd is disengaged. So simple but so clever...
DSG is a awesome from what i hear and have seen. I know that it can be handy on launching as proven to me.

how did the topic change from the VXR getting the Green light to the DSG Anyway?

[180HOA]

Personally, I've found the launch is the worst part of the DSG, because there's clutches and no torque converter like in a regular auto, the clutch doesn't begin to engage till you've taken your foot off the brake - so you have to give it a bit of time to fully release the clutch before you can gun it, otherwise you can get a lot of clutch slip. It's on the move that the thing is brilliant.

[SSS_Hoon]

DSG is a awesome from what i hear and have seen. I know that it can be handy on launching as proven to me.

how did the topic change from the VXR getting the Green light to the DSG Anyway?

quite simply ppl know where the action is :lol: no seriously i think me and 180HOA took it off topic a bit.

but i thought that the VXR already had the green light?


and shaun when did u get this launch experience with the DSG :lol: was it when u got beat by a girl :lol:


i dotn find the DSG that abd, although i will admit i take of slower then my gf in it, but that is most likely due to the fact that she drives it everyday.



SSS_Hoon

[aussie_in_london]

I have seen a straight line test on top gear and the VXR leaves the Golf (Both in Stock trim) for dead. Has about 2 -3 car gap over the GTi.


and just a bit of info mate
the pre prod VXR's as was the ones on top gear and press trials ran a different map to the production spec which has also been tweeked, Vxl are giving the auto mags production VXR's for long term testing as we speak, the ecu and steering map has been improved and the complaints on throttle sensitivity has been improved some what,
i drove mine back to back with a pre prod and also put it up against it and my prod model pulled away from it.

[Rhino]

Interesting that noone has brought up the Clio Cup...

Sure, TG did rate the GTi as the all-rounder (seemingly just based on style as it was the worst handling and slowest), but the clio beat the VXR and GTi around the track. Clearly a better handling car than both of them. Just behind the VXR on the 1/4... which had appalling torque steer... which most of us with modded SRiT's would know all to well.

As for the VXR being Europes answer to the WRX... That's a bold statement this early in the game... It seems to me that hot hatches generally have only until recently (about 10 years behind Subaru) started to show some signs of having a go at Subaru / Mitsubishi... who, have always had a great AWD base to build on and are now focussing on styling and ride.

Everyone else is putting out cars and just hoping they're good enough, or selling them cheap to 'compete'.

[GeeeAus]

"There's only one thing this car needs, a straight jacket....." Jeremy Clarkson

Nice car, very fast. Yummy looks.

Get acquainted with the handbrake. Put up with your Renault and VW mates beating you up in the corners, because you'll get em on the straights.

AWD is a must for this car’s future, the engine is THERE, but the output is just too much for a front drive car of the Astra’s wheelbase. AWD is the only answer; eventually they’ll do it. When GM gets itself out of the poo a bit more perhaps.

It’s certainly a good start for HSV in what is becoming a modern 4 pot world.

I’d love one, but not this one, its like buying Windows, wait until Vista 64 comes out.

In this case AWD.

GeeeAus

[aussie_in_london]

[QUOTE=SSS_Hoon}The VXR will most likely be hard to tune like the curent SRIT.SSS_Hoon[/QUOTE]

far from actually, Focus ST stage 1 seen it hit 255bhp same stage on the VXR saw 285 and destroy the focus, both ecu remaps done by powerchip, dont compare the zlet to the zleh, both may look the same from the top but thats where it ends
in the UK £1800 will see you around the 300bhp figure very easily, full milltek exhaust and remap, i know of one girl who has done it, sports switch off a nice 260bhp that just pulls away from mine running 252 with full milltek and the best part engage sport mod and an additional 45 plus ponies come to life, it left my mates standard VXR as if it was standing still literally, she had the remap done by 888 engineering / VXR Performance Centre, power delivery is so much improved and has no problems getting the power down, have mine booked in with Thorney Motorsport on Wed for the stage 2 and just shy of 300bhp.

[aussie_in_london]

Clearly a better handling car than both of them. Just behind the VXR on the 1/4... which had appalling torque steer... which most of us with modded SRiT's would know all to well..

you have only seen reports regarding the pre prod model VXR which are actually being scrapped as they run a different chassie/suspension set up and different ecu map, i have driven both pre prod and production back to back and there is a noticeable difference both in power delivery and handling, put mine up against the pre prod and mine nicely pulled away from it,
torque steer, have you driven a VXR yet? i doubt it, i think you are going to be pleasently suprised, not what the media made out it to be, my wife handles the 252bhp well and hasnt complained about fighting the car, yeah it has some torque steer like all fwd cars but it doenst rip it out of your hands, people misjudge traction and road cambers to often for torque steer,
the way i would compare a VXR to a GTI / ST, the VXR is a car you have to drive, its old school hot hatch, aggressive and alot of fun, you wouldnt be teaching your 16 yr old to drive in the VXR lol
GTI and the ST are very much alike, most shoot outs in the UK have rated the ST above the GTi of late because it is faster and everything is much the same, both are easy to drive at speed, very controlled but very souless, and thats the rating that are coming in when comparing the 3 and from many now selling their GTi's for VXR's, having driven the GTi and comparin it to my VXR, yes its nice and pleasent but wasnt fun, quiet the opposite, boring actually, and it felt slower im sorry, get in drive, arrive get out, nothing more to it, yeah i would feel comfortable teaching a 16 yr old to drive in the GTi and ST no way would i in the VXR.

and to finsih it off forget everything Clarkson said, the man is a clown and a funny one at that, he drove around in a SRi spec VXR, engine and body VXR, chassie/ suspension H SRi, i would expect it so suffer with torque steer and struggle on the bends wouldnt you.

[01CDsedan]

I'll be interested to see the local press reports on it - too many cars have been brilliant OS but completely failed when it comes to our roads.

Also seems like a lot to be pushing through the front wheels, as GeeAus said.

[blackSRi]

A further article that was out yesterday on the release:
http://www.carsguide.news.com.au/story/0,20384,18363348-21822,00.html
Baby HSV confirmed


http://network.news.com.au/image/0,10114,5118139,00.jpg
Holden Astra VXR hatch

06 March 2006




Paul Gover
The first truly hot hatch from Holden Special Vehicles is finally a goer.
The Astra VXR has been under study and development for close to a year, but is finally confirmed for local sales as the first baby car in the HSV family.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

..... aww....it's a baby lol! ;)

[Corsa]

people who buy an Astra VXR aren't the type of people who would buy a commodore based HSV
We aren't bogans for starters......sheesh!!!!

This just goes to show how narrow minded some people are. If you paid any attention to HSV's marketing exercise over the Astra VXR then you would have noticed that a lot of their sales they are hoping to pick up from existing customers buying it for use as their second car. They also are trying to break into a new market as well which will be the harder task to achieve. the 19" rims combined with the quality of our roads will be the biggets reason why i don't want one. That and i can think of better cars to spend my hard earned on. Currently I have as a daily driver an Astra turbo and have both HSV and HDT Commodores in my collection. To be quite honest one of the things i like about the Astra is it's wheelbase and track dimensions are very similar to that of the early Commodores. I basically buy my cars in a certain size range and the Astra fits in well with them but come long term i know which car will be first to go and which cars will hold their value better.
Earlier this year I had the privelige to drive the biggest engined Opel in Aust. but to you that would probably also be classified as a bogan's car. Would have loved to have had the chance to buy this car but am happy to say it is in good hands.
HSV Turbo build number 001 already has my name on it.
Corsa

[Red AH SRI T]

^^ someone obviously has no sense of humor, it was a joke

I reckon ur spot on about ppl buying it as a second HSV.

I too am a little weary of the 19's, i would have prefered the 18's

[aussie_in_london]

I too am a little weary of the 19's, i would have prefered the 18's

i went the 18's for handling over looks and yeah it is a difference when putting them back to back, 18's provide more directional steering (point and shoot) corrigated twisty roads they shine, my mate followed me closelsy into a twisty b-road at speed, the 18's soaked up the rivets and bumps, gripped and gave better feed back through the steering making control much easier, my mate riding on 19's bounced, the rear starting to slide braked and he wasnt in sight by the time i got to the other end lol
he back to back both and found the 18's much more confident and controlled then his 19's on the same stretch of road, he ended up saying i wasnt crazy as first stated when he relised how well the car handled ;)

[Red AH SRI T]

i wonder if perhaps i could import the 18's?

I like the look of them better too

[pred8r]

i wonder if perhaps i could import the 18's?

I like the look of them better too

get them to put them in the boot in Germany :P

[rusole21]

i love the car but as someone else said it would be great with all wheel drive. not that crappy mps system either but like the wrx or evo. more biased back wheel drive. infact if it was purely back wheel drive i would get one in a second!!! if i had the money. haha:D

[blueraven]

i will buy the 19's of any of you if you do buy a vxr to put the on my astra t...provided they fit of course (which i am pretty sure they do :D )...you can even have the std rims of my astra t for free ;)