Astra H Turbo vs Mazda 3 Turbo

[gaero]

Although we probably won't see these 2 cars until atleast late 2005, I think the Astra H has a real challange on its hands vs the Mazda 3 (even in the base model, and yes let the debate begin cause it ain't really been discussed on here before)

Am I a fan of the Astra H? answer is undecided, like a lot of people. I'm waiting for a sedan/coupe version to make it to oz. Currently I have a 2 door astra hatch which is more like a couple compared to the current wave of hatches (mazda 3 included) where the back just drops off, so no place for a big wing spoiler :( .

All I hope is that the Astra H turbo looks as good in real life as the pics that have been posted on here before. Otherwise if mazda bring their turbo out in the sedan, I know where I'm leaning towards.

Although the details on the Mazda 3 MPS (turbo) are sketchy this website has some info and they do list the Astra H turbo as a compeditor.

So whats the thoughts of peeps of Opelaus Land about having a choice between two turbos (unlike the last Astra G turbos, which had the entire market)?

BTW I park next to a Mazda 3 SP23 (black) every day at work, and when I see mine next to this, although both cars are equally sxy, I would never swap.


[web:51bf49b896]http://automobile.auto123.com/en/info/autonews/index,view.spy?cmd=view&artid=32779&pg=1[/web:51bf49b896]

[NUTTTR]

I've got an astra G 2.2 my mum has a 323 SP20 (not the latest mazda :)) and i've been in a mazda 3 as well.... (current version).......
The astra drives totally differently, the mazda (IMHO) drives like a cheapo japanese car ( :) i've always (pretty much) driven euro cars!)..... That's just my 2c... the mazda is a HELL of a lot noisier and rougher when driving and i'd NEVER trade the astra (my fiancee has a 1.8 astra H and it's a pretty nice car to drive too!) for the mazda...... noooo way :)
Aaron
P.S. That said, the mazda will be quick i'm sure, but if i want pure speed, i'll get a supercharged 351GT :)

[RK]

I've driven an SP20 heaps.. i love it. But thats probably because it has an awesome short shifter in it. It has awesome handling too, and looks great. Not too keen on the Mazda3's looks though. Sedan is pretty good, but the hatch looks too odd for me.

[Jass]

Will be intresting to see this too cars head to head. The astra turbo H OPC (if released with forged piston) will be a much better engine to upgrade and tune. Yet to see i guess if the mazda will come with the same goodies as the Astra.

Either way thought FWD turbo doesn't tickle my fancy too much, i would rather save and get the Mazda 6 turbo 4x4! :mrgreen:

[KevinFok]

ive never been a great fan of mazda's but when they released the mazda 3 my friends said i should have waited a bit longer for that but in my eyes i see my astra (2 door) a lot more sexier than the mazda 3

[Jackson]

yer agree, the hatch is cool because of the LED taillights but the shape is a little bit like a WRX hatch gone wrong.
i would get the astra myself.

no i wouldn't i would supercharge my cali, speaking about that i have asked so many people if they can help me find someone who will do a supercharger and no one will help me,

any suggestions,sorry to change topic :roll:

[rjastra]

The MAzda 3 MPS will be AWD... drivetrain will be the same as the Mazda 6 MPS.
Therefore I reckon you will be looking at $40K+ for the Mazda 3 MPS.

[Jass]

Are you sure about that, the Mazda MP6 will be AWD. Didn't hear anything about the Mazda 3 being AWD. The mazda 6 AWD is meant to be using the same driveline as the RS AWD turbo (rally).

Essentially its meant to be engineered by ford, but placed with a mazda shell.

Anyways if anyone has some concrete info then please post up!

[rjastra]

The mazda 6 AWD is meant to be using the same driveline as the RS AWD turbo (rally).


AFAIK the Mazda 6 drivetrain is predominately FWD and it redirects power to the rear wheels when required. And then only up to 50% of the power can be redirected in that direction... Doesn't sound like a rally car setup to me.

[Jass]

Cool, can you post some sources up here would be good to see some info on this.

[ultim8DTM5]

Nice comparo would be Colt Turbo (CZT?) vs Barina SRi 8)

[RK]

except the Colt looks like shit :S

[Jackson]

and it's called a colt, seriously should have given it a diff name if they want anyone under the age of 50 to buy one.

i don't know it's a grandma car to me

[Mr T]

The mazda 6 AWD is meant to be using the same driveline as the RS AWD turbo (rally).


AFAIK the Mazda 6 drivetrain is predominately FWD and it redirects power to the rear wheels when required. And then only up to 50% of the power can be redirected in that direction... Doesn't sound like a rally car setup to me.

Subaru work on the same system, seems to work OK for them.

I've never been a fan of Mazda or any Jap car for that matter, SP23 or not it is still made of lunch raping and has poor (read worse than Commodore) build quality.

I have to say even if this turbo Mazda comes out and is capible of 12 sec (just saying) I'd still drive a Euro car that only does 14s.

[EGG80X]

wait for the new 2005 echo (vitz RS) 1.8L vvti-L 6 spd only have to pull 850kg, the power to weight ratio is crazy

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/picture_library/dir_35/car_portal_pic_17647.jpg

but then again, we aussie always get the watered down versions....... like australia never got the Echo turbo, 4wd 110kw and only 830kg

[Jackson]

it's a 4 door though, pretty cool, i don'tmind the 4 door thing but i think lots of people do ??

[rjastra]

Subaru work on the same system, seems to work OK for them.

Of course it doesn't.... it is nominally split 50:50 all the time on manual models.

[Mr T]

Subaru work on the same system, seems to work OK for them.

Of course it doesn't.... it is nominally split 50:50 all the time on manual models.

Or....

...Is it a Frount Wheel Drive with Torque On Demand Traction Control system?

I beleive that it works the same way a Holdens new AWD system as just explained, which Holden adopted form Subaru.

[astra_city]

still made of lunch raping and has poor (read worse than Commodore) build quality.


I think that's a bit harsh :roll: Mazda's have good build quality, as do all Jap cars (nearly all). Most Jap cars have build quality just as good as Euro's that's for sure. Comparing any car to a Commodore build quality is a bit below the belt :P

[Wraith]

Jackson wrote:

no i wouldn't i would supercharge my cali, speaking about that i have asked so many people if they can help me find someone who will do a supercharger and no one will help me,

I also researched this in depth (for my V6 Cali) and sorry to say, unless you want to spend mega dollars and be someones test mule (your Cali ie ) you'll have to source the complete engine from over seas and yes still have to spend mega dollars. :evil:

I've given up the idea and went out earlier this year and bought a turbo Astra convertible instead (decided to leave my V6 Cali stock) - good luck to you though :wink:

[Mr T]

Build Quality is a term referred to quality of materials, stability, NVH (noise vibration harshness) and overall research and development.

A typical Jap car uses .52 gauge steel for paneling and Mazda use .48 gauge, Holden and Ford (Aus) use .52 and typical German cars use upwards of .7, Mercedes and BMW (for the big stuff) use up to 1.1 (a colourbond fence is .42)

Do you self a favour, go down to the local Mazda dealer and press one finger on the door panel of a 6 or 3 - you will notice how easy it is to bend the metal. Then do the same to a Euro. It is a real eye opener, it will change your perspective of cars for ever.

n.b. You may be confusing Build Quality with Reliability

[astro boy]

Subaru work on the same system, seems to work OK for them.

Of course it doesn't.... it is nominally split 50:50 all the time on manual models.
yep, and on the STI the DCCD can be set up to a maximum torque split of 35 - 65 to the rear which is still probably not enough for some serious side ways action.

Going back to what onenut said "You may be confusing Build Quality with Reliability"; Build quality ulitmately effect the reliability which Jap cars are ahead of Euro cars. The metal bending when you push it in is a good thing. I've done this on a Jeep grand cherokee and it just springs right back.

[Mr T]

Going back to what onenut said "You may be confusing Build Quality with Reliability"; Build quality ulitmately effect the reliability which Jap cars are ahead of Euro cars. The metal bending when you push it in is a good thing. I've done this on a Jeep grand cherokee and it just springs right back.

Ever heard of the term "tinny"

I drove a Mazda6 once, when I closed the door it sounded like I trod on a Coke Can. These "soft" cars are more susceptible to dings and scratches

I think that most people would agree that Hyundai are pretty ordinary cars and that their build quality is equally ordinary. Although I hear heaps of stories whereby owners constantly praise these little pus buckets for their reliability.

Although when I criticise the Japs, I should mention that Honda do make a good strong car.

[astra_city]

yeah what you mention are good points, but build quality also (in my eyes) includes how well put together a car is. Sit in a Commodore or Ford and look at the gaps between panels and interior plastics, the quality of the plastics and then compare it to nearly any Jap car. The Jap car will be far far better quality I can assure you.
But yes, build quality does involve a number of factors, but Jap cars are more reliable, are better put together (as mentioned), have better paint and generally are better to drive than a locally built Holden or Ford.
Euro's are another matter (of course I love Euro's - myself, my mum and my dad own Euro built cars!)

Cheers

[Mr T]

of course I love Euro's - myself, my mum and my dad own Euro built cars!



As do you.

The things you mention are also considerations of build quality

[Anonymous]

give me a turbo sri corsa/c any day :lol:

[AstraT20]

The mazda 6 AWD is meant to be using the same driveline as the RS AWD turbo (rally).


AFAIK the Mazda 6 drivetrain is predominately FWD and it redirects power to the rear wheels when required. And then only up to 50% of the power can be redirected in that direction... Doesn't sound like a rally car setup to me.

Subaru work on the same system, seems to work OK for them.

I've never been a fan of Mazda or any Jap car for that matter, SP23 or not it is still made of lunch raping and has poor (read worse than Commodore) build quality.

I have to say even if this turbo Mazda comes out and is capible of 12 sec (just saying) I'd still drive a Euro car that only does 14s.

Subaru is constand AWD, not predominatly FWD.

[Jass]

Has any body actually found articles explaining the way the AWD system will run on the Mazda 6? I hear alot of speculation but still no one has posted anything up here to back it up!

[rjastra]

Here ya go....



The hot 6 has a new on-demand all-wheel-drive system using sensors to detect steering angle, side G-forces, the pivoting movement of the car and engine power to decide which wheels need more drive.

Up to 50 per cent of power can be fed to the rear wheels when needed. \



Is it just me or are people just bloody lazy when it comes to looking things up... this took me 2 minutes to find. Ver heard of google? :roll: