Opel OPC performance models likely

[btm]

http://smh.drive.com.au/motor-news/opel-opc-performance-models-likely-20120731-23bdf.html

High performance OPC - or Opel Performance Centre - vehicles are on the radar of Opel Australia as it looks to boost its upcoming launch lineup.

Opel Australia has its hands up for the high performance OPC - or Opel Performance Centre - models as the flagships of its soon-to-be-established range.

Speaking ahead of the September 1 on-sale date for the three-model Opel range, the brand's Australian managing director, Bill Mott, admitted he wants the OPC variants.

"We don't have the confirmation but my interest is keen," says Mott. "We haven't confirmed that but we're very interested in it and I think that's the way we'd go with a performance range."

Mott suggested the main potential blockages were engineering factors, but hinted it was likely to be just dotting i's and crossing t's.
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"Before I tell you we're going to get it, I want a piece of paper that says we're going to get it. I'd hate to confirm something and then find out we're unable to make it happen."

The earliest the OPC cars could go on sale would be 2013, with Mott suggesting he wants them "sooner than later, but I couldn't give you a date".

"We've got to go through a formal process ... and engineering [for export]."

Currently Opel offers three OPC models on the models the brand is planning to launch in Australia.

The Opel Corsa OPC makes 141kW from its 1.6-litre turbocharged engine, the Opel Astra OPC makes 206kW from a 2.0-litre turbocharged four-cylinder and the Opel Insignia OPC develops 239kW from a 2.8-litre turbocharged V6.

"Whether we launch them all or not we'd still need to do some homework on," says Mott.

An Opel OPC car has previously been sold in Australia as the HSV VXR.

At the time it was seen as a significant first step - or re-entry - for HSV into the compact four-cylinder performance segment.

But the brand that has a reputation for high-performance V8s struggled for sales against more established hot-hatch competition.

Opel is also planning other models as part of its imminent arrival in Australia.

The Opel Mokka baby SUV is expected to arrive here in 2013 where it will compete with the new breed of compact, city focused off-road-style wagons.

Mott also said he would consider the next generation of the Opel Ampera plug-in hybrid car that is a twin of the upcoming Holden Volt.

Mott said that while the current Ampera and Volt are too similar to justify selling them alongside each other, the next all-new models of each are expected to be quite different, opening the door for such a vehicle.

Pics - http://smh.drive.com.au/photogallery/opel-opc-range-20120730-239li.html?selectedImage=0

[mickos]

Interior on the VXR looks tops and the twin exhaust exits. Could do with a more aggressive rear bar diffuser

[Hoss]

Good news. Let's hope it happens, but the pricing will need to be competitive against the established plays in the "hot hatch" segment.

[rjastra]

Good news. Let's hope it happens, but the pricing will need to be competitive against the established plays in the "hot hatch" segment.

I am not sure how it will be competitively priced locally when the Astra VXR is significantly more expensive than its competitors in the UK.
The Focus ST (not a direct competitor undertandably) with 183kw/360Nm will be $38.2K+ORC here!

[kabel]

Renault and VW hot hatches are above $45k + on-roads.
Those that want an OPC Astra will part with the money I am sure.

I am not ready to part with my VXR yet.
But I will certainly be looking to trade or sell the Astra G SriT on an OPC Corsa as my daily driver.

[Wraith]

It will be interesting to see how the price points play out...

The hot hatch segment and cooking models hatch segment is ever increasing in competition...

Last weekend I went to my local MB dealer to check out what will definitely also be a major player and competitor in this segment - the new MB A Class hatch, in short it's a ripper and it's price point (45-60k driveaway for all variants bar the AMG 45 variant) suggests it'll effectively compete against the VW Golf range, so it'll attract all buyers from that price point segment also.

The AMG 45 is also going to be something else, it will feature the most powerful 2.0ltr IL4 petrol production engine ever made, designed to compete against the new 135i hatch and RS3 it'll have a base output of 261kw /450nm and an AMG powerpack optioned 294kw / 510nm, it'll also have AWD and 7spd DCT or dual clutch trans.

Opel needs to introduce a dual clutch trans for models like the Astra if it is to successfully compete against the VW Golf range, because at least 75% of sales on that vehicle are chosen with the auto...

[rjastra]

Renault and VW hot hatches are above $45k + on-roads.
Those that want an OPC Astra will part with the money I am sure.


But they aren't. GTIs start under 40K+ORC. Megane RS starts around 42K+ORC.

[rjastra]

Last weekend I went to my local MB dealer to check out what will definitely also be a major player and competitor in this segment - the new MB A Class hatch, in short it's a ripper and it's price point (45-60k driveaway for all variants bar the AMG 45 variant) suggests it'll effectively compete against the VW Golf range, so it'll attract all buyers from that price point segment also.

The AMG 45 is also going to be something else, it will feature the most powerful 2.0ltr IL4 petrol production engine ever made, designed to

yeah, the A class looks great... and if you can handle blandsville the new BMW 125i hatch is good value for a RWD turbo hot hatch. 135i will be a goer as well.

[glider]

Opel needs to introduce a dual clutch trans for models like the Astra if it is to successfully compete against the VW Golf range, because at least 75% of sales on that vehicle are chosen with the auto...

I would argue that isn't a valid comparison as there was no 'regular' auto offered alongside the DSG in the Golf range to compare sales with, only manual.

[Milesy]

It will be interesting to see how the price points play out...

The hot hatch segment and cooking models hatch segment is ever increasing in competition...

Last weekend I went to my local MB dealer to check out what will definitely also be a major player and competitor in this segment - the new MB A Class hatch, in short it's a ripper and it's price point (45-60k driveaway for all variants bar the AMG 45 variant) suggests it'll effectively compete against the VW Golf range, so it'll attract all buyers from that price point segment also.

The AMG 45 is also going to be something else, it will feature the most powerful 2.0ltr IL4 petrol production engine ever made, designed to compete against the new 135i hatch and RS3 it'll have a base output of 261kw /450nm and an AMG powerpack optioned 294kw / 510nm, it'll also have AWD and 7spd DCT or dual clutch trans.

Opel needs to introduce a dual clutch trans for models like the Astra if it is to successfully compete against the VW Golf range, because at least 75% of sales on that vehicle are chosen with the auto...

Opel will have a conventionsl 6sp auto on the cooking models and for 99% of the target market they wouldn't know the difference or even care. To these buyers a DSG is just a more expensive auto.

Thankfully at least the OPC models remain manual only (as they should be) for the true enthusiast rather than pretenders who are too lazy to use their left leg!

[Wraith]

I would argue that isn't a valid comparison as there was no 'regular' auto offered alongside the DSG in the Golf range to compare sales with, only manual.

True about the bottom end variants, but it's the Gti Golf variant that both Opel and MB are targeting, Opel with the GTC and OPC and MB with the new A250.

If Opel wants alot more sales they'll have to eventually supply an auto option...


Opel will have a conventionsl 6sp auto on the cooking models and for 99% of the target market they wouldn't know the difference or even care. To these buyers a DSG is just a more expensive auto.

Thankfully at least the OPC models remain manual only (as they should be) for the true enthusiast rather than pretenders who are too lazy to use their left leg!

Also true alot of people see ab auto as an expensive option, but again look at the sale stats across the board, autos outsell in every segment !!!

Personal biased opinion aside, as that's what it always comes down to for stick shift only people, I can tell you that the only reason Opel don't put an auto/twin clutch type trans on those models we're discussing is because they don't have one ! (yet) not because they don't want to offer one...

[benzino]

if they can source diesel engines from fiat, they could have sourced the fiat dual-clutch if they wanted one...

[ChrisMaz]

Doubt transmission tech was part of the deal.

[Vectracious]

I'm tempted to think the whole dct thing is just because vag started it and it's now become fashionable. I'm not saying that dct's aren't good (I used to have one) but with good programming you could make a conventional auto behave almost like a dct anyway.

MB only recently jumped on the bandwagon and up until then their normal autos were considered some of the best in the business. BMW only offered theirs on the M models - (correct me if I'm wrong) but their normal autos are very good too.

There's good reasons for and against opel offering an auto option on their opc models. I dunno what the right answer is but going down the path of just offering manual opc cars could work for them just as well.

[Wraith]

Good point Pete regarding 'type' of auto, standard non twin clutch types are also very good these days, that isn't the main point IMO, the main point is actually having and offering an auto option across the board of models and all their variants for effective competing and maximum sales...

Again it comes down to sales - success = sales !!!

Autos of whatever type are sought after at an average of 3:1 versus manuals of all car types out there, not just cooking models but performance vehicles as well, we could put up a list of performance vehicles that don't even have a manual variant, because the demand for the manual was just so low it was costing manufacturers more money to just keep the parts inventory for them going...

Autos also maintain better resale value and sell alot easier than manuals again because that's what most people want.

Also agree that regardless of who wants what, if there's both manual and auto available then you just choose the one you want, each to their own...

If the new Opel OPC is to successfully compete against the Golf Gti/R and the new A Class hatch, then it needs the auto variant if it's going to have any hope of coming close to the sales numbers those other 2 are going to have in auto guise, there's no doubt at least 3/4 or more of those (VW & MB) sold will be autos, that would equate to double or tripple the number also that Opel would otherwise have sold on its model...

[Vectracious]

Agree with some of that Ange, and I know that the thread started off talking about auto availability in general, but as people started discussing DCT vs conventional autos - I thought I'd go with the flow.

As for sales success of a model being dependant on an auto transmission being available, what about the WRX? IIRC an auto option was discontinued with the 2002 or bugeye model and has only been available as a manual since then - it didn't seem to have affected it's sales - and the auto never sold in large numbers anyway.

As Milesy said, maybe Opel will stay manual only with their OPC models because they want them to be considered a "hardcore" drivers car (my speculation) - meanwhile if you are a poseur - you can have your DSG Golf R where you can run optimum times all day with launch control and pretend you are an awesome driver ;)

As for the new MB A-class hatch would surely be way above the Astra in terms of price and competitors - more like Audi A3 or BMW 1 series.....

[Wraith]

AFAIK the WRX's auto was not very good in its operational capability, ie. sloppy slow shifts and it sapped too much of the power output that's why it was canned, Subaru do have decent twin cluth technology they use it in their rally cars but it hasn't come over to mainstream use 'yet' it's just a matter of time probably the new upcoming models will feature a DSG type trans :)

Also on the other hand their main competitor the Mitsu Evo and rallyart variant are doing just fine with their new twin clutch auto, in fact the rallyart is one of those cars I mentioned above which does not have a manual option...

If Opel are indeed happy to have manual only OPC variants then fair enough, however I still find that hard to believe, fact is as said they don't have a choice on the matter is more like it, I'm sure they'd love to be able to sell as many as possible not just to a small niche clientel we're not talking about some limited run exotic...

Pricing for the new A Class is known (I've been shown info from MB Aust. orders already taken) the cooking models range from 40-60k driveaway, in that price bracket it will easily compete with the VW Golf and Audi A3 range and also whatever Astras are in that same price range, an A250 fully loaded is 60k driveaway, after seeing what the A250 is all about, I know which I'd choose over the competition in that price range - it's a no brainer... :)

Just speaking for myself I'm in total anticipation of the new A45 AMG variant, it's going to be a cracker in everyway, can't wait to test drive one sometime next year could end up joining my vert as weekenders :D

[benzino]

I think the a-class doesn't make such a good comparison as it's so much more expensive...

MB and audi... yes
MB and vw... on the edge and only the fully optioned models

hell if the A250 fully optioned is 60k, then the stretch to 70k for the audi S3 doesn't seem like much at all
regardless of the marque, that's still a shite load for a hatchback...

[rjastra]

AFAIK the WRX's auto was not very good in its operational capability, ie. sloppy slow shifts and it sapped too much of the power output that's why it was canned, Subaru do have decent twin cluth technology they use it in their rally cars but it hasn't come over to mainstream use 'yet' it's just a matter of time probably the new upcoming models will feature a DSG type trans :)

Also on the other hand their main competitor the Mitsu Evo and rallyart variant are doing just fine with their new twin clutch auto, in fact the rallyart is one of those cars I mentioned above which does not have a manual option...


It seems Subaru is heading down the CVT path with their cars.
The EVO/Ralliart is a dead duck. Judging by their dabbling with hybrids etc they will go down the CVT path as well (its a Japanese thing)

ZF (i think) has a new 8 speed and 9 speed torque converter based autos out specifically designed for FWD. In the long run I can see DSGs being phased out, in city cars, for these. They are smooth, compact and cost effective. Buyers, especially the USA, don't like the way DSG gearboxes work.


hell if the A250 fully optioned is 60k, then the stretch to 70k for the audi S3 doesn't seem like much at all
regardless of the marque, that's still a shite load for a hatchback...

If i told you a Vauxhall Astra VXR is similar money, in the UK, to a A250 AMG what would you say?

The hot hatch market here is very competitive. If a M135i is going to be 68K+ORC then a A250 wont be 60K

[benzino]

that makes more sense :)

[Vectracious]

If i told you a Vauxhall Astra VXR is similar money, in the UK, to a A250 AMG what would you say?


That Australian consumers get shafted big time when it comes to what we pay for the big 3 German luxury brands compared to the rest of the world.

[benzino]

yeah... I guess that's where Opel will have their advantage as the "budget" German

[ChrisMaz]

And this is where the Stigma of "Budget" comes into play.

[benzino]

Exactly, but I don't think it will be as detrimental as the stigma attached to Hyundai compared to Toyota, Mazda, Honda (the budget option compared to the big 3 but asian not german)... but I guess opel never had the excel... hahahahaha

only time will tell, but I think they are in the right slot, under $30k they will sell like hot cakes

[rjastra]

only time will tell, but I think they are in the right slot, under $30k they will sell like hot cakes

I hope you are right... but I don't think they will. Unless they can get an Astra model ON THE ROAD for <23K then they are rooted. Why do you think Holden still sticks that boat anchor 1.8L under the bonnet of the Cruze? To get a low price model on the market.
They have no answer to the Golf GTI or Polo GTI... both of which make up a large (25+%) of overall Golf/Polo sales at a higher margin.

[Wraith]

ZF (i think) has a new 8 speed and 9 speed torque converter based autos out specifically designed for FWD. In the long run I can see DSGs being phased out, in city cars, for these. They are smooth, compact and cost effective. Buyers, especially the USA, don't like the way DSG gearboxes work.

Completely agree on that re. the new 8sp family of ZF autos, just look at the performance times of both the new 1 and 3 series BMW's fitted with that box, the excellent acceleration times and economy numbers are mainly due to that new 8sp auto...



If i told you a Vauxhall Astra VXR is similar money, in the UK, to a A250 AMG what would you say?

The hot hatch market here is very competitive. If a M135i is going to be 68K+ORC then a A250 wont be 60K

Thank you for pointing that out, I've been trying to explain the very same thing :)

Alot people here are interested in the new OPC AJ or possibly a RS250 Megane or a Golf Gti or R, the price range of those vehicles including the best seller of them all ATM the Gti is line ball with the new A Class range up to the A250 fitted with the AMG kit which will be the range topper of the petrol variants, MB have purposely priced the A Class to directly compete with the VW Golf range, there's also going to be an A220-CDI which is rumoured to include AWD.

The AMG A45 is going to be in the same class as the Audi RS3 and 135i hatch and those vehicles will cost between 70-100k and are in another league anyway compared to the Gti and OPC Astra :)