PDA

View Full Version : Skyactiv



vectra.lee
1st July 2011, 11:02 AM
http://smh.drive.com.au/melbourne-motor-show/2011-melbourne-motor-show-new-engine-to-debut-on-mazda3-this-year-20110701-1gtsg.html

It's about the new Mazda Skyactiv engine.
Apparently it's meant to be really awesome.

And I read somewhere yesterday about how consumers need to pay for more environmentally friendly technology to be available en masse.

Opinion Question: If people are really worrying about the environment and want to make a difference, AND there are technologies which can help with that...shouldn't those technologies be available readily and without a massive ask from our wallets?

Lots of issues involved with this.
Just wanted to create an open discussion about the Mazda's engine itself, and also the implications.

Wraith
1st July 2011, 12:01 PM
Nice one !!!

It's all over and being discussed for a long time over at the Mazda forum I'm a member of :)

In a nut shell if the Skyactiv engines and transmission power trains end up being as good as the literature and tests have so far revealed, Mazda are going to romp !

Basically the SkyactivG (gasoline or petrol) engine has compression ratio lifted to 14:1 and the 2.0ltr version can achieve similar power output to their current 2.5ltr engine and about half the fuel burn...AFAIK there's a smaller displacement version that's around 3.3ltrs/100km...

The SkyactivD (diesel) engine has its compression dropped to the same 14:1...

It uses a different approach to other current turbo diesels and will have twin turbo arrangement like most newer Euro turbo diesels, but apparently it accelerates and sounds just like a petrol engine, yet will still deliver better economy than traditional diesels...

I'm seriously considering updating my everyday SP25 if these things turn out as good as they sound :)

BradstaMS
1st July 2011, 05:22 PM
I'm seriously considering updating my everyday SP25 if these things turn out as good as they sound :)

Second that!

Vectracious
1st July 2011, 07:17 PM
Opinion Question: If people are really worrying about the environment and want to make a difference, AND there are technologies which can help with that...shouldn't those technologies be available readily and without a massive ask from our wallets?



So if we dont pay for it - who does? There's absolutely no way any government would directly subsidise it, and car makers are out there to make money in the end of the day so they need to recoup their R&D costs as well.

rjastra
1st July 2011, 11:15 PM
The new Mazda3 SKYACTIV will be fitted with Mazda’s new SKYACTIV-G 2.0-litre direct-injection petrol engine built with an extremely high compression ratio of 12.0:1. The Mazda engineers have developed the engine to withstand such high pressures by applying cavity-top pistons and mulit-hole injectors.

The engine produces 113kW of power, at 600rpm, and 194Nm of torque, available from 4100rpm. The engine is promising to be the most efficient in its class when it debuts later this year, a feat which is, in part, thanks to a new SKYACTIV-Drive six-speed automatic transmission which is said to blend the key characteristics of a dual-clutch auto and a CVT auto.


We don't get the 14:1 comp ratio (neither does USA etc)
In fact if I am not mistaken this engine is very similar to the 2L DI engine to be found in the new Focus.

Wraith
3rd July 2011, 10:46 AM
We don't get the 14:1 comp ratio (neither does USA etc)
In fact if I am not mistaken this engine is very similar to the 2L DI engine to be found in the new Focus.

Not sure rj what the final specs of the skyactiv engine range will be or to what markets they'll land ??

Alot of printed material is still mentioning the comp ratios being an equal 14:1 for both petrol and diesel skyactiv engines, although as you point out it may be different in different markets maybe due to differing fuel quality...

We'll know all about it by the end of this year when the first releases are due - Mazda 2 AFAIK...

Mazda are also going to reduce the weight of their vehicles by using different grade materials, this will also contribute to the reduced consumption figures as well as better performance and is an integral part of the skyactiv program :)

rjastra
3rd July 2011, 11:55 AM
Not sure rj what the final specs of the skyactiv engine range will be or to what markets they'll land ??



Those figures were released at the Melbourne Motorshow



Mazda are also going to reduce the weight of their vehicles by using different grade materials, this will also contribute to the reduced consumption figures as well as better performance and is an integral part of the skyactiv program

All manufacturers are doing this ;)

Wraith
3rd July 2011, 12:15 PM
Those figures were released at the Melbourne Motorshow



All manufacturers are doing this ;)

That would make sense as we're using 91 ron unleaded...

And yes agree way ahead for all manufactures is to reduce the weight of their vehicles, aluminium and composites will be the norm in the distant future :)

Neeko
3rd July 2011, 12:20 PM
Those figures were released at the Melbourne Motorshow



All manufacturers are doing this ;)

Mazda will get the 14:1 compression ratios as well as idle stop for the Mazda 2. Thats what Mazda QLD have informed us with at work. The 2 will have it's consumption halved!! Some great technology is going into these new cars, should definitely help out with the struggling past few months that Mazda have had.

scaifeys2.2mk4
3rd July 2011, 03:58 PM
Mazda will get the 14:1 compression ratios as well as idle stop for the Mazda 2. Thats what Mazda QLD have informed us with at work. The 2 will have it's consumption halved!! Some great technology is going into these new cars, should definitely help out with the struggling past few months that Mazda have had.

i believe we will be getting an engine with a 13.5:1 ratio and it will be a 98 octane only affair

rjastra
3rd July 2011, 05:23 PM
Mazda will get the 14:1 compression ratios as well as idle stop for the Mazda 2. Thats what Mazda QLD have informed us with at work. The 2 will have it's consumption halved!! Some great technology is going into these new cars, should definitely help out with the struggling past few months that Mazda have had.

Big deal... it has a whopping 63kw...it should be economical with that power output. ;)

Turblue
3rd July 2011, 06:42 PM
...........

I'm seriously considering updating my everyday SP25 if these things turn out as good as they sound :)

If MazdaEdit can read/write your ECU, a few tweaks and you may well end up with better fuel economy. I did my Mazda, and get ~15% better fuel economy.

Wraith
4th July 2011, 08:23 AM
If MazdaEdit can read/write your ECU, a few tweaks and you may well end up with better fuel economy. I did my Mazda, and get ~15% better fuel economy.

Hey there Wayne and G'Day stranger how are you mate :)

With regards to the new skyactiv's, I was always interested in going for the skyactivD diesel but I thought they wouldn't be available for quite some time, hence I decided on the SP25 earlier this year...

I'm willing to update prematurely now when they're released, ie. if they turn out to be as good as they say, so don't really want to bother playing around further with the SP25...

We'll keep in touch mate, I'm sure they'll be some tuning enhancements around for this future skyactiv range :)

Turblue
11th May 2014, 05:23 PM
Wraith....

Ah yes, years between posts...!!!

But I have news, and a looooong memory.

I am currently working with a few people on a tune for the SkyActiv diesel.

And first indications are that not much needs to be changed, and the results are VERY promising. I'm targeting about 27PSI boost. And it pulls hard.

Cheers All.



Hey there Wayne and G'Day stranger how are you mate :)

With regards to the new skyactiv's, I was always interested in going for the skyactivD diesel but I thought they wouldn't be available for quite some time, hence I decided on the SP25 earlier this year...

I'm willing to update prematurely now when they're released, ie. if they turn out to be as good as they say, so don't really want to bother playing around further with the SP25...

We'll keep in touch mate, I'm sure they'll be some tuning enhancements around for this future skyactiv range :)

SilentShout
17th May 2014, 12:59 AM
My only beef is with a compression ratio of 14:1 im going to go ahead and assume they will need some sort of premium fuel be it 95 or 98 octain. The market of people buying these cars (Mazda 3, 2 etc etc) are the market that steers clear of premium fuels. Eg. Mum goes to fuel station, 98 is $1.70 per L but e10 is only $1.30 per liter. pretty sure she will choose the cheaper option.

The only way i think this would be okay is if direct injection could be manipulated in such a way to cancel out knock (Injecting the fuel right at the point of ignition) then it is viable (maybe not e10, for those who use it. please dont.)

on the subject of engine tech, Id love to see more engines coming out with direct injection, there are some nuts things out there that DI can do.

There is the engine from the Nissan ZEOD, 1.5L, 3cyl, 400hp and it weighs just 40kgs. 400hp that you can literally pick up.

theres also word of Alpha romeo working on a direct injection, variable compression, camless, turbocharged 1.6L four banger that is guestimated at 600hp (iirc) with a rediculous power delivery due to being able to go from a stupid comp ratio at idle (something like 16:1) to 8.8:1 comp ratio at a full boost of something silly (25psi or so).

Havnt heard much about it, only that they were struggling with the camless aspect, controlling the valves individually via solanoids, computers cant keep up past about 4500rpm (also iirc).


A little off topic sorry but engine tech and innovations are something that intreagues me to no end :)


If were keen to look at future tech google the Thorium car ;)

Milesy
17th May 2014, 02:33 PM
It's all marketing. Mazda are just trying to hang on to larger displacement engines to avoid the extra cost of turbo charging. IMO they have backed the wrong horse and will be left behind in the future. You just have to at all the other car manufacturers. They are downsizing and adding one or more turbos to get the performance of a larger engine with the fuel economy of smaller ones.

SilentShout
17th May 2014, 04:38 PM
They are downsizing and adding one or more turbos to get the performance of a larger engine with the fuel economy of smaller ones.

Good example is the DI 1.6T currently in the veloster and the pro_ceed. 150kw from a 1.6L from the factory, never thought id see the day :P

poita
17th May 2014, 05:30 PM
The OPC Corsa is what, 141kw. And that came out 3 yrs ago. The nurburg version was 155kwish from memory. Was only a matter of time

Sent from The Batphone

Vectracious
11th June 2014, 08:02 PM
My only beef is with a compression ratio of 14:1 im going to go ahead and assume they will need some sort of premium fuel be it 95 or 98 octain.

All the skyactiv petrol engines available in oz on the 3 and 6 run on 91 RON



Sent from my SM-T310 using Tapatalk

SilentShout
11th June 2014, 11:45 PM
All the skyactiv petrol engines available in oz on the 3 and 6 run on 91 RON



Sent from my SM-T310 using Tapatalk

How do they get away with a comp ratio of 14:1 on 91 RON?

I can imagine knock would be an issue. The best of the best NA tuned engines run at 11.9:1 (some higher with lots of engine work)

Exceptions to this do include the Prius however as it runs on the atkinson cycle its not truely a 13:1 comp ratio

EDIT

Looks like the Skyactiv is also an Atkinson cycle engine. Now that makes sence :lol:

Neeko
12th June 2014, 07:30 AM
How do they get away with a comp ratio of 14:1 on 91 RON?

I can imagine knock would be an issue. The best of the best NA tuned engines run at 11.9:1 (some higher with lots of engine work)

Exceptions to this do include the Prius however as it runs on the atkinson cycle its not truely a 13:1 comp ratio

EDIT

Looks like the Skyactiv is also an Atkinson cycle engine. Now that makes sence :lol:

In Japan it's 14:1 not in Australia.
We always miss out on the good stuff :(

I love Mazda's and their skyactiv technologies. probably has something to do with the fact I drive one home every day :p

5334

Neeko
12th June 2014, 07:31 AM
Love the twin turbo set up the diesels get.

5335

SilentShout
13th June 2014, 12:47 AM
Love the twin turbo set up the diesels get.

5335

http://www.reactionface.info/sites/default/files/imagecache/Node_Page/images/1311626491256.jpg

IM trying to process that but I cant. Maybe if i saw another angle.

So far it looks like exhaust goes into the ant sized exhaust housing on the bottom turbo then flows to the larger one on top and then out.

But the intake housing from the bottom turbo goes into the intake housing of the top turbo, with another random wastegate on the front no where near an exhaust..


My brain hurts....

Neeko
13th June 2014, 07:04 AM
Two-stage turbocharger
All modern diesels use a turbocharger to improve output and fuel economy while reducing harmful emissions. In the name of pure driving fun, Mazda goes one step further on the SKYACTIV-D: namely two-stage sequential turbocharging. The system features one small and one large turbocharger, which are selectively operated according to driving conditions. The small, quick-responding turbo feeds air to the combustion chambers at low engine speeds. This ensures low-speed torque while eliminating turbo lag, which is characterised a poor low-range throttle response caused by a lack of exhaust pressure to rotate the turbocharger’s turbine up to a speed necessary to supply boost pressure. The role of the larger unit is to maintain the air supply and boost pressure throughout the upper speed range . Together, the two turbos deliver high torque and responsiveness at low engine speeds and high power right to the SKYACTIV-D’s 5,500rpm redline – unusually high for a diesel. There is no compromise to power, driving dynamics or driving enjoyment, despite the engine’s extraordinary efficiency. The synergetic effect of the two-stage turbocharging and low compression ratio ensures optimal combustion timing across the rpm spectrum while, thanks to a sufficient supply of oxygen, keeping NOx and soot emissions to a minimum.

So good to have access to all this stuff

hazrd
13th June 2014, 07:17 AM
that is very very cool

Shadow110
13th June 2014, 08:37 AM
+1 for that... so its kind of like a soarers twins or even the subaru b4 set up on steroids?

SilentShout
13th June 2014, 01:14 PM
I do understand how that kind of twin turbo setup works but it is facinating that a diesel has a 5500rpm redline!! =P

What I dont understand is where the inlet and outlet on the picture is xD thats what hurts my head =(

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk

Vectracious
14th June 2014, 08:13 PM
Nico, do the Mazda diesels have a dpf?

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk

Neeko
16th June 2014, 07:50 AM
Nico, do the Mazda diesels have a dpf?

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk

Sure do! They had a recall on them already because the oil was diluting itself too much when the DPF did it's thing.

OPC1
1st July 2014, 10:00 AM
In Japan it's 14:1 not in Australia.
We always miss out on the good stuff :(

I love Mazda's and their skyactiv technologies. probably has something to do with the fact I drive one home every day :p

Yeah, we'd be driving one also (the 6) if it was just a few inches shorter. Just wouldn't fit in the garage properly without ripping out a lot of stuff.

I thought the Mazda SkyActiv initiative was a really good one. Not only the motors got a going over, but the body (stiffer, yet lighter) and the electrical systems (run from capacitors filled from waste energy like braking and heat instead of from the motor). Making for a car that was larger, lighter, better handling and more fuel efficient. We loved it to drive, but when we took it for a test fit in the garage...d'Oh! The Suby is pretty good as a family car alternative, though.

SilentShout
1st July 2014, 01:13 PM
that sounds great n all but...

Will it blend? :lol: