$6bn rescue package for automotive industry

[bornwild]

What do you guys think of this?

I think it's a load of crap. They will get $6bn over the next 13yrs and everyone knows that the result of this will be nada, zilch, zero...absolutely nothing. Why should Australia be giving money to American/Asian companies?

Why doesn't the government get a couple of interested parties together and make a truly Aussie company from scratch up. If Holden or Ford go belly up, just buy their factories and employ every single worker that's lost a job with them. It's not like Holden or Ford are trying to do anything for the Australian people, we may as well make our own car where we control where it's gonna be exported, what engine it's gonna use etc...instead of some yank idiot who makes or breaks Ford/Holden from an office in Detroit. And $6bn is more than Tesla Car Co. ever had to start off with hence we will be able to produce a great Australian car of the future.

That's just my view.

Thoughts?

[DirtyHarry]

yep i agree, why not invest that money into a company that would make electric cars or something along those lines

[poita]

i know im going to start a shit fight, but these days what doesnt on this forum.

instead of investing in all these magically hybrid and electric cars, why not invest in solar panel technology.
people whinge about how there is all these green house gases and shit, why not develop something we already have. it will bring the cost of solar power down for the average home consumer. they make it seem like we are assholes cause we dont use re-newable energy, why not try to make it affordable.
i know it has been discussed before here, but what happens when there is 5 million electric cars around australia being charged. the grid will melt, and not cope.

im tired, im sick and i feel like shit, so deal with my rambling on :p



OT: yes we should have a car company of our own to rely on, so $$ stays here

[bornwild]

Well yeah either way, as long as we don't invest into GM and Ford!

I was thinking more along the lines of investing into research of fuel-creating fungi and bacteria. :) And also, creating an Aussie diesel car for the future that runs on this fuel :)

[Huhness]

This labor ****ing government is throwing our money around willy nilly! IF the ****ing company cannot help itself then tough luck! BYE BYE! use the 6 BILLION DOLLARS like poita said and buy the factories and start a REAL aussie company. there is no real aussie car or car manufacturer.

:mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad: :mad::mad::mad::mad:

Thats 6 Billion dollars that just fled the australian shores and is being used to line the pockets of executives..

This is just like the $60M they gave to Toyota to make a hybrid camry.. Oh wait you were already going to make one whether we gave you $60M or not.. ****! ****! ****!

Sorry i'm just pissed of at the current rate Labor are shitting money to these companies.

[oneightoo]

heres a thought...

why do you think there is no one true home grown aussie car company??

that builds their own cars and engines here??

becuase it's not viable, thats why..

how good would a business be if they made all this lovely stuff for us and it costs a fortune for little return.. it'd be a dud business, and the government isnt going to throw money at a company thats not going to make a return.. simple..

whinge all you like about gm and ford getting a handout, it's a sensible option for where money should be sent..

i would love to see the govt spend the same money setting up a company that creates clean cars.. but it just aint gonna happen.. solar panels are so inefficient it takes years before the benefit outweighs the setup, and thats both $$ and pollution..

[bornwild]

Well if they invested thos $6bn into a company, that company could use ford and holden factories to create a reasonably priced if not cheap good quality Aussie car...it's not like Holden/Ford are doing us any favours either!

[daiflu]

it's not like Holden/Ford are doing us any favours either!

These companies employ thousands of Australian workers who, in some cases are paid up to 20 times that of a similarly ranked employee in another country. These companies support even more Australian workers in component manufacturing companies. You must expect some pretty big favors!

[nuggz]

Well if they invested thos $6bn into a company, that company could use ford and holden factories to create a reasonably priced if not cheap good quality Aussie car...it's not like Holden/Ford are doing us any favours either!


$6bn isnt much in terms of car companies

Didnt holden spend 1bn on development of the latest commodore?
and thats with infrastructure in place already

[bornwild]

These companies employ thousands of Australian workers who, in some cases are paid up to 20 times that of a similarly ranked employee in another country. These companies support even more Australian workers in component manufacturing companies. You must expect some pretty big favors!

Funny thing is...they're sacking them 1 by 1!

[bornwild]

$6bn isnt much in terms of car companies

Didnt holden spend 1bn on development of the latest commodore?
and thats with infrastructure in place already

Yeah but Holden was developing a complete new template for GM to build tens of models on.

[stevedee3]

For anyone who hasn't read it, here's the government's paper "A New Car Plan for a Greener Future":

http://www.innovation.gov.au/automotivereview/Documents/NEWCARPLANGREENERFUTURE.pdf

[daiflu]

Funny thing is...they're sacking them 1 by 1!

Just like any other manufacturing company at the moment.
Would sacking them all at once be a better option?

[tim_]

This labor ****ing government is throwing our money around willy nilly!
Sorry i'm just pissed of at the current rate Labor are shitting money to these companies.

i agree. it's burning a hole in their pocket.

[Wraith]

Hmmm, this is an interesting one and on the surface of it all, ie: what we see, read and/or know it would appear to be a totally wrong thing to do...

But as always in the World of big business and politics, there are so many unknowns to the general public, we don't know what all the deals going on are about, we don't know what all the facts and figures are about, so we can never know what the appropriate decisions would be, or if those decisions made by Government are correct or not ???

I'm sure in saying that for the Government to be appropriating a sum of $6 billion into a company or industry sector or similar, they must have a clear mandate on what they're doing and what they plan to achieve, in this case it's spread over a 13 year period, so there must be some major long term goals set out, all we can hope for, since it's something that has been put into action, is that there's a positive/successful outcome for Australia...

Don't know what's contained in the article above put up by stevedee3, the damn link froze my computer...would've liked to have read it :)

[Shaun]

Having the government invest heavly in both GMH and Ford Motor Company they are securing jobs. There keeping the Unemployment rate down.

The government wont loose out. They are trying to keep the economy afloat.

Also the government will make money out of Export that GMH and Toyota as well. Both are exporting products overseas.

At least the Rudd Governement are tying to combat what The USA and Europe are already hit hard buy. We are going to go into that big dirty
'R" word but if the government do what they have done atm so far the blow could be less then other countrys are expriencing.

If we do end up like the USA and Europe it will last for about ten years. The Rudd Government have basically said we will support you through this down period which means they support Australian Jobs and industry.
The Best thing the Reserve Bank can do is keep dropping interest rates as people will start spending again.

[bornwild]

Mate, investing $6bn dollars is a short term thing..."give a man a fish and you feed him for a day, teach a man to catch fish and you feed him for a lifetime".

Both GMH and Ford are fundamentally crippled companies. Crippled by poor decision making and poor investments. And they are not Australian owned. Ford would do so much better if Ford US allowed them to export...but nooo Ford US doesn't let them export the Falcon because noone would buy the Crown victoria anymore.

[stevedee3]

Don't know what's contained in the article above put up by stevedee3, the damn link froze my computer...would've liked to have read it :)Don't know why that would be... anyway here's a link to the HTML version:

http://www.innovation.gov.au/automotivereview/Documents/NEWCARPLANGREENERFUTUREweb.html

[rjastra]

$6B.... perhaps federal labor will take a leaf out of NSW Labor and can the whole thing in a year. ;)

[Huhness]

http://www.news.com.au/business/story/0,27753,24639993-462,00.html

Har Har Har.. Lining the pockets.. Stupid ****ing Government.

[Wraith]

Don't know why that would be... anyway here's a link to the HTML version:

http://www.innovation.gov.au/automotivereview/Documents/NEWCARPLANGREENERFUTUREweb.html

Thanks stevedee3, this link works just fine :)

[MK]

http://www.news.com.au/business/story/0,27753,24639993-462,00.html

Har Har Har.. Lining the pockets.. Stupid ****ing Government.

As much as i have respect and love for the Australian Ford and Holden...its time for a radical change, the Labour handout will do nothing bt line up the pockets of GM USA CEO's. The AU factory worker will lose out and join the unemployed queue :(

look what happened to Mitsubishi Australia? where are they now?

this is my way of thinking:
1. Holden and Ford, immidiate stop in production of Falcon and Commodore. come up with small 4 cylinder car that majority of m\Australian families want and can afford at these critical times.
2. HSV and FPV to produce high performance and expensive cars for nieche markets only.
3. more government investment in research and development of greener and cheaper cars produced here in Australia.

i might be wrong or simply dreaming bt thats the way i see it...its just a joke to see a $40,000 Commodore or Falcon when i can have a $25,000 Corrolla or Astra which will suit my family more.

[chrissn89]

$6bn dollars health system and roads thanks Mr.R

[deviant]

So I read in the news last week that Matell Toys is worth more than GM and that GM is worth less than it was in post war USA....and that they also need US$7Billion to meet their next round of bills followed by another US$1Billion per month after that just to stay afloat.

Lo and behold this week the Krudd gumbyment finds a spare AU$6Billion to give to 'Holden'....Of course we all believe you Mr Krudd :rolleyes:

I think the only thing thats going to stop GM canning Holden is the fact that Holden was smart enough to build a product that is sold around the world as various models. The latest Commodore IS a world class car. Also with Holden bringing out the displacement on demand system they are thinking towards a future where emissions based tax and fuel use really matter.

Ford on the other hand...Oh dear...Ford US is in no better a position than GM hence why they have really been pushing their 'World Car' philosophy with the Fiesta, Focus and Mondeo...cheap, mass produced, very well built and reliable.
Ford Australia IMHO has been caught napping. They have built a car the rest of the world does not want AGAIN. Make no mistake Ford Aus is in trouble and I reckon the Falcon will be gone very soon. Another clue to that is in the Mondeo; its almost as big as a Falcon but better built and nicer to drive and with the XR5 able to outrun an XR6 while using less fuel and costing the owner less to buy.

Cynical...me?

[bornwild]

Why didn't the government buy out Holden from GM for a couple hundred millions? That would have secured a lot of jobs and future income...

[Shaun]

Why didn't the government buy out Holden from GM for a couple hundred millions? That would have secured a lot of jobs and future income...

Why would the goverment want to do such a thing? Leave it with GM . They have gone through all this before. They will bounce back from it.

[Shaun]

As much as i have respect and love for the Australian Ford and Holden...its time for a radical change, the Labour handout will do nothing bt line up the pockets of GM USA CEO's. The AU factory worker will lose out and join the unemployed queue :(

look what happened to Mitsubishi Australia? where are they now?

this is my way of thinking:
1. Holden and Ford, immidiate stop in production of Falcon and Commodore. come up with small 4 cylinder car that majority of m\Australian families want and can afford at these critical times.
2. HSV and FPV to produce high performance and expensive cars for nieche markets only.
3. more government investment in research and development of greener and cheaper cars produced here in Australia.

i might be wrong or simply dreaming bt thats the way i see it...its just a joke to see a $40,000 Commodore or Falcon when i can have a $25,000 Corrolla or Astra which will suit my family more.

Holden have a small Size family car in the range. Its call an Epica. Its cheaper to bring in the Korean built Products such as the Barina Viva and Epica then build them locally. For a start they arent going to stop building the commodore. They need to get the return on there billion dollar project. So therefore a new factory plant would need to be built meaning new tooling etc. This would run into millions of dollars then you have the R & D and testing of a new model on top of this.

GM worldwide have already started looking at alternates. So far they are building certain cars in certain countrys. All Small platform stuff is coming out of Korea. Mid Size stuff Europe and Large size out of Australia and the USA. (the USA is a large market and GMH wouldnt cope producing all the large products here)