Oh Crap...

[Orion_996]

Anybody read the news on carpoint.com.au this morning regarding Holden's future imports? Well here it is... (Sorry bout the crappy editing there, I'm at work so i was in a hurry)


Holden's switch to Korean small cars will make sense by early 2009...


Holden's current two-tier small car range based on the Viva and Astra models has never made much sense -- but it soon will! Due for preview at the Paris motor show later this year are new Korean-built replacements for both the current Viva and Euro-sourced Astra.
Just as the local Holden Captiva range is made up of entry models shared with Chevrolet and a premium Captiva Maxx, which is sent to Europe badged as an Opel, Holden insiders have revealed the company will market two levels of GM's new global small car.
A more stylish, safer and better-equipped version of the Viva will define a slick new entry point for Holden's small car range and take the battle to the Toyota Corolla. And for the first time, it will be totally styled by an Australian 'schooled' Holden Design team. Much of the engineering fine-tuning will also have been completed in Australia -- as was the case with the Captiva.
Because this new entry level Viva will be marketed across the globe as a Chevrolet, Holden will be able to present the new model with family styling links to the Captiva and new Colorado light commercials with little investment in appearance changes.
The shared economies of scale with Chevrolet should therefore allow Holden to maintain the current Viva's sharp pricing despite a dramatic improvement in almost every area.
For those Holden buyers who have valued the European feel and looks of the Astra, Holden will also have access to the very different version of this new small car as developed and styled for the European market. It's understood that the differences between the variants may include a more sophisticated independent rear suspension.
That said even the ‘Astra' version will be sourced directly from Korea alongside the ‘Viva'. Holden therefore should be able to maintain sharp pricing for a model that will take the battle to its European rivals.
Both new ranges are expected to go on sale locally in the first quarter of 2009. The Melbourne Motor Show in late February has been discussed as the logical time to reveal the new range to Australians.
Before that a facelifted Barina light car will arrive Down Under, in the process telegraphing some of the styling punches of new Viva/Astra pairing.

[SSS_Hoon]

you all knew it was coming.


SSS_Hoon

[EL BURITO]

Well I guess i am not having another Holden.

I wonder how the product will stack up and what name plate it will display. If it is Astra well values will go down VERY quick :(

They will have to be of a really high quality thou to not have the issues they are having with the current Barina

[Calibrated]

omfg. **** you holden **** you up your tight ass.

[cdxi]

I read it as well....

I'd like to think it's not entirely correct. We've seen a heap of spy pics of the new Chevrolet Lacetti, but nothing of a "European" version of this car. It is, however, more about platform sharing.

Perhaps the whole point of the article is that this new car and the the next gen Astra will share a single platform, like the Captiva/Antara. Both will be built in Korea and exported around the globe. I think this new car will be marketed by Chev in the US and Europe under the same name (maybe Lacetti) as they have done with the Captiva, Epica and Aveo (Barina).

Opel/Vauxhall will continue with the Astra and sell the next generation in the US as a Saturn.

What we should read from it is that Australia, US and SE Asia will get the two different cars (Lacetti/Viva and Astra) from the same platform from the same factory in Korea.

We already know that this vehicle will ditch the current Family II 1.8l DOHC engine and maybe have a newer version of the current Astra engine. It will also have the new 6spd auto that debuted in the Epica in January. It will also have the same diesel as currently fitted to the Captiva and Epica.

It will be a quantum leap over the current Viva and probably Astra as well, so instead of thinking we're going to get yestertech duds, let's all hope that the GM revival plan will work and that small Holdens will again be a strong presence in benchmarking the class.

We have to have some hope

[glider]

start a holden boycott imo

[Apex]

Sad. :(

[Ishley]

Does this mean the resale of the AH will drop because the new model in Korean?

[glider]

thats what happened to the corsa c didnt it?

i wonder what a korean astra turbo would be like... :(

==edit=

i wonder if a few people will sell it early as a result

[EL BURITO]

Yes it probly dose look at Barina prices

[MatsHolden]

Don't think it really affected XC Barina prices. Still see 2nd hand XC's on the lot for up to 14,990.

[cdxi]

This new car will be revealed at the Paris Motor Show and will debut as the Chevrolet Cruze and will go on sale in Europe/US in the first quarter of 2009, with other markets to follow.

see www.autoblog.com (http://www.autoblog.com) for more details

[Charlatan]

Don't think it really affected XC Barina prices. Still see 2nd hand XC's on the lot for up to 14,990.

No one is buying for that price though. I ended up cutting an XC SRi (unmarked 04 model with 29km) to $11,750 to get it to move. There are a lot of people who think they are still worth $15k (me included until reality struck!).

The Barina nameplate has been affected by the Daewoos. Astras will be the same.

[SSS_Hoon]

Yeah the SRi C's are so cheap now.

If i were looking at getting a new 2nd hand car i think i would go for the SRi Barina. OR even a SRiT G they not too bad now.

I think that my next car will be a brand spanker though, too much trouble with older cars especially when it comes to modding grrrr....


SSS_Hoon

[GreyRex]

I guess I was lucky and/or clever with my update 04 Barina SRi. Bought it privately a year old for $18,800. Sold it privately 2 years later for $16,500... with 40,000kms on it. I did spend $2K on wheels, so either a $2K/$4K loss in 2 years wasn't too bad in my books. I was stoked!! Really enjoyed that car :)

[JohnBu]

In terms of resale - All 2nd hand cars are cheap these days. the residuals of the average 3o cars are dropping.. from say 60-70% a decade ago to 40-60% today

Why? supply and demand. As more new cars are being sold today, therefore there's less of a secondary market- this will reduce the prices paid by 2nd hand buyers.

This is great for 2nd hand buyers (like me), not so great for buyers of new cars.

The Barina SRi is no worst than other cars of the same vintage.

You gotta remember it is a 5 year old car that was $22k new.

After 5 years, 50% residual within the norm.

Try seeing what your average 5yo HSV/Tickford/Saab/Ford/xyz is worth.

The only car is see with higher resale values today are the MkV Golf GTi's & Mini's.

I'm not sure what it is about the GTi's... because the sellers are asking crazy prices for a 2nd hand car, but I wonder what they are really selling for.

we're (not me) in the market for the GTi, but 2nd hand doesn't seem much cheaper than new.

[GreyRex]

In terms of resale - All 2nd hand cars are cheap these days. the residuals of the average 3o cars are dropping.. from say 60-70% a decade ago to 40-60% today

Why? supply and demand. As more new cars are being sold today, therefore there's less of a secondary market- this will reduce the prices paid by 2nd hand buyers.

This is great for 2nd hand buyers (like me), not so great for buyers of new cars.

The Barina SRi is no worst than other cars of the same vintage.

You gotta remember it is a 5 year old car that was $22k new.

After 5 years, 50% residual within the norm.

Try seeing what your average 5yo HSV/Tickford/Saab/Ford/xyz is worth.

The only car is see with higher resale values today are the MkV Golf GTi's & Mini's.

I'm not sure what it is about the GTi's... because the sellers are asking crazy prices for a 2nd hand car, but I wonder what they are really selling for.

we're (not me) in the market for the GTi, but 2nd hand doesn't seem much cheaper than new.

Agree :)

At that point in time I was expecting to sell it for less, but the buyer knew what he wanted, was happy with it... and said i'll take it.

With the GTi, is it possible that it's very rare to find a completely stock one... so because nearly all are optioned, it creates a 'higher' playing field for resale... along with their 'reputation'?

[EL BURITO]

The only car is see with higher resale values today are the MkV Golf GTi's & Mini's.

I'm not sure what it is about the GTi's... because the sellers are asking crazy prices for a 2nd hand car, but I wonder what they are really selling for.

we're (not me) in the market for the GTi, but 2nd hand doesn't seem much cheaper than new.

that is the exact same thing I was told by the dealer when I was looking into getting a GT, He said they hold there value better than most other cars.

I think it is also has alot to do with supply and Demand, given the limited number they bring into the country.

If your still looking at one thou go the 3 door as it is the only one brought to Aus that is made in Germany.

As for the price on the Barina I think besides the fact I took a easy rd to get the car sold I could have only made a extra 1k ontop of what I got off Juice for the car

[JohnBu]

thats true,

most are optioned with with at least two or not more options: leather, DSG, Sunroof, Metallic Paint(!!!!!), Xenons, Sat Nav.

With their dealer deliver fees, some ppl pay up to high $50s for their GTi.

Crazy I tell you. the R32 makes alot of sense, if you want to option the GTi up.

Again, its supply and demand. Don't wan't to pay close to retail, thats fine, there's a 3 month waiting list, i'll sell it to the next sucker.

I prefer the 3 door- better looks, cheaper and made in Germany... But the car isn't for me, so has to be 5 door.

I've seen the quality of the 5 Door South African built one.. overall its no better than my Astra, although the interior is excellent.

I'm not sure why the 'Golf' has a reputation... the cars aren't the most reliable, parts are uber expensive, servicing cost are outrageous and customer service is poor.

Think of it as Audi/BMW/Merc pricing for servicing, without the customer service.

Still, I like the GTi :)

Went to test drive the BMW 1 series hatch.. they handed the keys over and said take your time.

Went to VW to test drive the GTi, was ignored by the sales ppl, crappy showroom, and oh, sorry the GTi in the show room is sold, a new one will come in next week to test drive but call us to make a booking.

why wouldn't u keep a demo of one of the most popular models to let ppl test drive.

[USC]

OMG...lol...Im laughing my a** off!!! Korean Astra beauty..cant wait to see that piece of poo.

[EL BURITO]

Went to test drive the BMW 1 series hatch.. they handed the keys over and said take your time.

Went to VW to test drive the GTi, was ignored by the sales ppl, crappy showroom, and oh, sorry the GTi in the show room is sold, a new one will come in next week to test drive but call us to make a booking.

why wouldn't u keep a demo of one of the most popular models to let ppl test drive.

BMW 1 series has the shortest warranty in Aus of any new car

agree with the statement about VW thou of the 2 dealers in Perth only one would let me take a test drive and I went with another customer cos we were both fed up with waiting

[Vectracious]

Went to VW to test drive the GTi, was ignored by the sales ppl, crappy showroom, and oh, sorry the GTi in the show room is sold, a new one will come in next week to test drive but call us to make a booking.

why wouldn't u keep a demo of one of the most popular models to let ppl test drive.

You hear this all the time with VW dealers - maybe because the cars are selling themselves so well and there is such demand for the GTi - sales staff just don't give a sh*t. My wife went to our local VW to look at the Jetta and she was ignored as well - when she finally found someone to talk to - the salesman had no idea about the product and seemed very disinterested about finding any info out - to get a brochure from him she actually had to ask twice for him to get one......

We didnt go back.

[JohnBu]

BMW 1 series has the shortest warranty in Aus of any new car


Three Year unlimited kilometre warranty doesn't seem the shortest? haha

where did you get that idea from?

What did you end up getting Pete?

I don't think VW are doing that well. 16,407 YTD (to end of June)

Toyota 127,440 YTD.

Hyundai are outselling VW 3 to 2.

What is interesting is Alfa Remeo are doing poorly, 717 YTD, worse than Saab

[Vectracious]

What did you end up getting Pete?


Originally went to look at the Tiguan but the boot is too small for a SUV, so then she went to look at the Jetta's

In the end we went to Honda and got a CR-V (and the customer service was excellent!)

[EL BURITO]

Three Year unlimited kilometre warranty doesn't seem the shortest? haha

where did you get that idea from?



If I am proved wrong, I will retract my comment

from the information I found on the 1 series it was stated as 2 years unlimited KMs.

all other models were 3 years

[JohnBu]

http://www.bmw.com.au/scripts/main.asp?PageID=11989&PID=18

[ASTRAY]

omfg. **** you holden **** you up your tight ass.

x 1,000
holden are obviously thinking the same way as the nsw gov, short term profits.
no vision for the future.
the day holden put an astra badge onto a daewoo, that'll be the day i remove my astra badge, i will be too ashamed to say i own an astra.
why replace reliable, popular cars with peices of crap :confused:
have a look around when you are on the road next, try to spot old daewoos from when daewoo manufactured and sold them themselves, there are hardly any.
why?
because they have all shat themselves and are sitting in wrecking yards, not worth the patch of oil they are sitting in.
holden, dont do it!

[glider]

the day holden put an astra badge onto a daewoo, that'll be the day i remove my astra badge, i will be too ashamed to say i own an astra.


thats the day we should all become VXRs :p

[dieselhead]

Oh well, you lost me Holden. If I can't have the Euro version of the new Astra then my next car will be an Audi.

[glider]

probably have to agree with that, gotta say I like the looks of the A4

[ASTRAY]

thats the day we should all become VXRs :p
no, itll be a simple, yet proud, "i own an opel"

[GreyRex]

no, itll be a simple, yet proud, "i own an opel"

Then we'd get the standard issue response from most people... a what?

[KingOfAstras]

All Astra owners... Unite and OPELISE!!!! *transformer sound effects*

[ASTRAY]

All Astra owners... Unite and OPELISE!!!! *transformer sound effects*
:cool:
we shall become the opelisers, walking the streets at night replacing peoples holden badges with opel badges, hehe

[KingOfAstras]

:cool:
we shall become the opelisers, walking the streets at night replacing peoples holden badges with opel badges, hehe
Hahahahahaha! The Opelisers - Boycotting Holden since 2008.

[ASTRAY]

Then we'd get the standard issue response from most people... a what?
hehe, thats what makes it even more prestigous.

[Wraith]

This is not very good news at all !!!

I'll never buy another Astra again if they're going to be rebadged Daewoos...

What does this mean for the turbo Sri t and VXR models ??? will there be no more of them offered anymore ?? or will they have a Daewoo equivalent ??

Even worse, is this the end for OpelAus ?? I mean eventually down the track, the only 'real' Opels will get older and start disappearing from the roads :(

[glider]

depends if people keep their astras in the same way that people have kept calibras...

if they do, it should survive...

[Wraith]

depends if people keep their astras in the same way that people have kept calibras...

if they do, it should survive...

Well I certainly fit into that bracket - I have the newest Calibra in Aust. (and plan to keep it in the family) and am never parting with my Astra t vert, but don't think there'll be many others in the same boat.

Cali owners will probably all get rid of em sooner or later as they become problamatic with age...

Astra owners seem to eventually 'move on' when they can afford to do so...

There'll probably only be a small group of us left in the long term future :(

[glider]

personally i'll be holding onto this Astra until i pay off the loan (2012) then have a think about what to do...

it wont really have anything going for it by that stage, especially being non-turbo

[dieselhead]

If I opelize my future A3, do I still belong here? :)

[Wraith]

If I opelize my future A3, do I still belong here? :)

Hahahaha LOL :D

TBH I've always had an anti Opelising attitude, because for many of my own reasons I think it's a rather pointless exsercise and invites thieving scum which can cause serious damage to the car - but with this news, hell even I might start Opelising all my planned new future cars, of which none were going to be Holdens or Opels anyway, except maybe if there was going to be an outstanding future Opel Astra model...

[Dowie]

Astra owners seem to eventually 'move on' when they can afford to do so...


Being only 18, only owning 1 car, never having owned anything other than 1.8 nor never having owned a turbo, when the door opens to move on, im certain i will take it. I suppose when im older, i will think about more about my use of money, etc but it seems to me that your only young once.
So ive got to fully agree with you on that one :)

[d.c.]

TBH I've always had an anti Opelising attitude, because for many of my own reasons I think it's a rather pointless exsercise

...and I thought I was the only one.

This is really sad news, I am most worried about the VXR and Turbo models as the hot hatch market is so competitive at the moment it would be a shame to lose one and reduce the playing field.

Or even worse a get a poorly built Korean turbo Daewoo that gives fwd turbos a worse name.:(

[ASTRAY]

Hahahahahaha! The Opelisers - Boycotting Holden since 2008.
hehe, and we'll run around changing daewoo holden badges back to daewoo badges.
imagine a holden dealers face in the morning when they discover all the cars in the lot have daewoo badges...

[cbrmale]

My Astra might have the first and last Holden I ever owned. It's a pity, cause the SRi is a great blend of performance, roadholding, comfort and safety at a reasonable price. My wife's XC Barina caused me to go down the Opel route, it has fantastic dynamics and safety, while still having reasonable ride and good practicality.

My experience of Korean cars is the sub-contracted parts, especially electrical, are really sub-standard. Korean cars are quite unreliable. The other problem is they aren't particularly safe. Hyundai is better than Daewoo-Holden, but even the latest i30 isn't flash with an 84% survival rating on latest tests, compared to the current Astra at 96% for the same test. And the Koreans haven't sorted chassis dynamics out yet, typically Korean cars are sprung too soft to handle better than average.

[SSS_Hoon]

hehe, thats what makes it even more prestigous.


thats funny opel and prestige LoL...


had my laugh for the day.


It is a sad day though.

I think they may keep the SRiT and the VXR as they are as i cannot see a Daewoo version.

IF they dont then i can see there sales dropping even more so then they have already.

i know i will get flamed for this but the current barina(daewoo) aint that bad in the looks department its nothing compared to the C but its not like its completly ugly to look at either with a few minor mods done to it.

SSS_Hoon

[GreyRex]

I can see styling cues here from the Epica and new Barina...

http://www.leftlanenews.com/chevrolet-cobalt-2010.html

and then Astra in the rear tail lights

Oh no :eek:... maybe it's beginning

[EL BURITO]

http://www.bmw.com.au/scripts/main.asp?PageID=11989&PID=18 Two Year Unlimited kilometre Genuine Parts and Accessories replacement cover

so what dose that mean?

there going to use non genuine if u break down in the 3rd year of the warranty ?

[JohnBu]

it means that if you use a genuine BMW parts when servicing your car, or say replacing a faulty window switch outside of warranty, BMW will provide 2 years warranty on the part.

This is not about new car warranties.

If you buy a BMW, you'll want driving pleasure to come as guaranteed. For this reason, from 1st March 2006* every BMW is covered by a:

1. Three Year unlimited kilometre warranty
2. Three Year Unlimited kilometre Roadside Assistance and Accident Management
3. Two Year Unlimited kilometre Genuine Parts and Accessories replacement cover

you just don't like to listen and be proven wrong now don't you.

[GreyRex]

Has anyone seen the latest edition of either Wheels or Motor with an article on the next gen VXR? It has the new Mitsu Evo on the front... probably released today. Didn't get a chance to read it properly.

Does it confirm what we already knew?

[EL BURITO]

you just don't like to listen and be proven wrong now don't you.


I am happy to listen, I just didn't understand what that was saying.

[JohnBu]

fair enough! haha

one question about the XR4,

i've driven the zetec, but my god had left leg cramps after 15 mins..

does the XR4 have a foot rest for your left leg?

[EL BURITO]

one question about the XR4,
does the XR4 have a foot rest for your left leg?

I wish!!! but there is a little bit of space on the LHS but not much

and I do a 45min daily commute :(

[JohnBu]

so where you put your foot?

[poita]

:offtopic:

[GreyRex]

Chevrolet 'Astra'

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/news/autoexpressnews/224616/chevrolets_astra_spied.html

[USC]

Chevrolet 'Astra'

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/news/autoexpressnews/224616/chevrolets_astra_spied.html


damn ugly...

[ASTRAY]

totally agree with usc, butt ugly. same horrid grille styling as the viva and daewoo barina.
seen the new colarado ad on tv today, is that a daewoo? im assuming it is.
if so i dont know how holden can advertise it as tough, itd be about as tough as toilet paper when youve got a bad case of the runs!

[MitchSRi]

So hang on.

Carpoint publish this article and everyone shits bricks. Every other media outlet featuring the 2009 facelifted Astra has hinted Holden will be bringing IT out here.

So unless the facelifted Astra going around is partly shit .. err I mean Korean built ... then I have my doubts Holden will go ahead with an asian built Astra.

Try as they may you CANNOT replicate the build quality of a european built car.

If it does go ahead, might be swapping my badges over despite me not intending too.

Ahh well at least the Focus is slightly euro these days (despite being built in SA).

Given my SRi has been the best car I've had to date, if Holden expect me in 3 years when I may roll the car over to buy a POS korean shitbox with a 1 star safety rating, they can go have intercourse with themselves.

I'll go buy something like a Honda or a Mazda or Subaru. Heck maybe even a Skoda or a Fiat!


Not only will I have to change my signature, but it will be car sales SUICIDE on behalf of Holden. At the moment the Epica and Viva barely sell, and the Barina is doing quite poorly itself. Introduce the Asian Astra, and you can kill that off as well. Commodore will be the first model that Holden might actually sell over 100 in a year!!

I had the sad job of telling someone that bought a new Barina the other week that the car has a poor safety rating and comes straight out of GM's Asian partsbin.

[ASTRAY]

So hang on.

Carpoint publish this article and everyone shits bricks. Every other media outlet featuring the 2009 facelifted Astra has hinted Holden will be bringing IT out here.

So unless the facelifted Astra going around is partly shit .. err I mean Korean built ... then I have my doubts Holden will go ahead with an asian built Astra.

Try as they may you CANNOT replicate the build quality of a european built car.

If it does go ahead, might be swapping my badges over despite me not intending too.

Ahh well at least the Focus is slightly euro these days (despite being built in SA).

Given my SRi has been the best car I've had to date, if Holden expect me in 3 years when I may roll the car over to buy a POS korean shitbox with a 1 star safety rating, they can go have intercourse with themselves.

I'll go buy something like a Honda or a Mazda or Subaru. Heck maybe even a Skoda or a Fiat!


Not only will I have to change my signature, but it will be car sales SUICIDE on behalf of Holden. At the moment the Epica and Viva barely sell, and the Barina is doing quite poorly itself. Introduce the Asian Astra, and you can kill that off as well. Commodore will be the first model that Holden might actually sell over 100 in a year!!

I had the sad job of telling someone that bought a new Barina the other week that the car has a poor safety rating and comes straight out of GM's Asian partsbin.

i havent had to tell anyone yet but i can imagine your experience, theyd be like why are you bagging my car, its a great car.
and you knowing a little better would be trying to explain why your bagging it, but because its their new car you were probably trying to be gentle and not getting far at all.
i truly feel sorry for anyone who buys one, makes you want to stand out the front of the yard and warn people.
you know what would be interesting to see, a new barina which has just had a smash with a couple of year old opel sourced barina. im sure people would understand then.

[MitchSRi]

Indeed ..

Well originally it started off and they was looking at Astras. I told them the Astras were well worth the money and were euro built.

They thought that because the Barina was the same name as the old one, that it was still built in Europe.

I just said "sorry actually the new Barinas are all Daewoo's rebadged", and they said "but it still has the 5 star safety rating".

and I said "did the dealer tell you that because it's four less than that."

They were suprised.

[glider]

Indeed ..

Well originally it started off and they was looking at Astras. I told them the Astras were well worth the money and were euro built.

They thought that because the Barina was the same name as the old one, that it was still built in Europe.

I just said "sorry actually the new Barinas are all Daewoo's rebadged", and they said "but it still has the 5 star safety rating".

and I said "did the dealer tell you that because it's four less than that."

They were suprised.

if the dealer did tell them that they should be reported for misleading them which may or may not have otherwise influenced their decision to purchase the vehicle

[ASTRAY]

heres proof for all our suspicions

daewoo barina, 2 stars out of 5 for safety
opel barina, 5 stars out of 5 for safety.
more info here
http://blogs.drive.com.au/2006/08/how_safe_are_holden_small_cars.html