The Veccy is not good.... guess it right... and win a prize!

[Tfer]

Okay... as I have posted here somewhere, the Veccy C (3.2l V6 manual) took on a load of dirty fuel. Had to have her fuel tank removed and cleaned, fuel system cleaned out, and injectors removed and cleaned.

Now when Holden put her all back together, they did say she was having some issues with idling rough, but apparently tweaked her and sorted her out.

Today... problem is back, and she is currently back with Holden (I will be in Melbourne from tomorrow to Monday night, so won't have her back till Tuesday I would imagine).

Symptons are:

Engine management light flashing on and off (and sometimes on solidly)
Rough, very rough idle.... hmmm, Holden told that me that the previous problem was not enough fuel was getting in through each injector... causing some dramas
Very rough under load (ie. accelerating, or pressing accelerator down)
Lack of power (feels much less powerful than a 1.8l auto AH Astra, one of which I drive regularly... and no criticism intended)
Engine will sometimes just die.... mostly when coming to a stop, but will start easily.So she is not a happy girl, and I don't think I would have taken on board more dirty fuel.

So..... here's the thing. If you can correctly diagnose the problem (my judgement, and no correspondence will be entered into), the winner receives a prize... 2 Birch Carol & Coyle movie vouchers.

So, no smart arse comments here.... I am simply turning a negative into a positive.... it's almost Christmas.... and I am feeling generous. Also, we have many "experts" on board here.... now's your chance to strut your stuff.

At this stage, Holden probably won't be looking at the Veccy later today, so I do not know, nor will I tell anyone else the updates.

So.... come on.....:)

[Calibrated]

Did they change the fuel filter and fuel pump?

[Tfer]

Did they change the fuel filter and fuel pump?

Fuel pump not changed, and according to Holden, my Veccy C does not have a fuel filter.

[PaulyJ]

You're coming to Melbourne and we dont know about it?

[Tfer]

You're coming to Melbourne and we dont know about it?

Yes I am.... I have been posting it in The Garage thread for the past 2 weeks :D

But yes:

Arrive lunchtime Friday
Staying at Saville City Suites, East Melbourne
Leaving Monday evening
We are down for a 40th at Fitzroy on SaturdayR seems to have me booked out (hence why I wasn't trying to catch up with the lovely Victorian members) but if I have any time spare.... can I text/email you? But I don't have your number :o

[oneightoo]

ok this could be a long shot, but it did happen to my parents veccy b about 4 years ago..

part of the bladder in the fuel tank had somehow come loose and was "floating" around in the tank.. it would occasionaly block the fuel line inside the tank.. the result was exactly what you have described - very rough on idle, lack of power, engine light..

is your car doing this constantly? or is it often but with moments where it runs fine? my parents car would be a lot more often then not, and would come back whenever the foot would go down heavier.. it would be like a massive flat spot then it goes to rough idle piss me off mode..

it took 3 trips to holden before someone figured this out.. but they replaced the tank and the problem dissapeared, and the car has been trouble free ever since.. a guy at holden said it's not the first time he had seen it happen on a vectra b or even the astra g..

do i win a prize?

[Wraith]

Hey Thomas, sorry to go off topic, but I too didn't realise you were in Melb. this weekend......yes I should spend more time in the off topic section :)

Maybe we can organise a quick meet up.....I'll be doing my usual Nth West to Sth East travels on Sunday - perhaps I could drop by where your staying in East Melb.

PM me your ph. no. and we can see how we stand - Pauly and others, what do you think ?? maybe we can make a mini meet out of it......

Oh as for the probable symptoms of your cars problem - too many to mention LOL :)

[Tfer]

ok this could be a long shot, but it did happen to my parents veccy b about 4 years ago..

part of the bladder in the fuel tank had somehow come loose and was "floating" around in the tank.. it would occasionaly block the fuel line inside the tank.. the result was exactly what you have described - very rough on idle, lack of power, engine light..

is your car doing this constantly? or is it often but with moments where it runs fine? my parents car would be a lot more often then not, and would come back whenever the foot would go down heavier.. it would be like a massive flat spot then it goes to rough idle piss me off mode..

it took 3 trips to holden before someone figured this out.. but they replaced the tank and the problem dissapeared, and the car has been trouble free ever since.. a guy at holden said it's not the first time he had seen it happen on a vectra b or even the astra g..

do i win a prize?

Not sure yet, but wow, certainly has some similarities...... will keep you posted Matt :)


Hey Thomas, sorry to go off topic, but I too didn't realise you were in Melb. this weekend......yes I should spend more time in the off topic section :)

Maybe we can organise a quick meet up.....I'll be doing my usual Nth West to Sth East travels on Sunday - perhaps I could drop by where your staying in East Melb.

PM me your ph. no. and we can see how we stand - Pauly and others, what do you think ?? maybe we can make a mini meet out of it......

Oh as for the probable symptoms of your cars problem - too many to mention LOL :)

PM sent :)

[Apex]

Bugger, sounds like a definite fuelling problem. So it would be a process of elimination.
Good luck mate.

[Tfer]

Bugger, sounds like a definite fuelling problem. So it would be a process of elimination.
Good luck mate.

And luckily they can have her for today, Friday and Monday, and most likely Tuesday..... hmmm :o

[DirtyHarry]

how can it not have a fuel filter??? thats just stupid.

but anyway could be the fuel pressure regulator. did they check the fuel pressure at idle and load?

[xplosv57]

Flux capacitor usually could cause this problem....

where do i pick up my prize??

But seriously, 182's description sounds about right, seen a few cars with your symptoms and has been a result of a fuel pump issue and seeing as thats the only thing in your fuel system that hasn't been serviced or replaced, i'd go with that!!

[Calibrated]

Flux capacitor usually could cause this problem....


yep, he cant get up to 88mph

[Tfer]

how can it not have a fuel filter??? thats just stupid.

but anyway could be the fuel pressure regulator. did they check the fuel pressure at idle and load?

How would I know (regarding the lack of fuel filter) .... I am the last person on here to get my hands dirty.... as I am not mechanically minded in the slightest.

But... I will get them to check this :)


Flux capacitor usually could cause this problem....

where do i pick up my prize??

But seriously, 182's description sounds about right, seen a few cars with your symptoms and has been a result of a fuel pump issue and seeing as thats the only thing in your fuel system that hasn't been serviced or replaced, i'd go with that!!

Good point! :)


yep, he cant get up to 88mph

No... smart ass :p

[Tfer]

Holden have said the following problems exist:

Fault codes on the ECU indicate the ECU needs replacing (RRP $2,050 plus labour, but with trade price servicing, down to $1,850 fitted) :eek:
Oh, and all spark plugs need to be replaced as they are fouledSo I asked had we tried the Veccy with new spark plugs first.... no, but they will just foul up again, came the reply. So humour me....new spark plugs in, and she is purring fine..... they said it won't last long.

Thoughts anyone :confused:

Again, this is sooo far out of my league :o

[stevedee3]

Fuel pump not changed, and according to Holden, my Veccy C does not have a fuel filter.Whoever told you that is telling porkies - all Vectra Cs have fuel filters. If you check your owner's manual you'll find it's scheduled to be replaced every 60k km!


Holden have said the following problems exist:
Fault codes on the ECU indicate the ECU needs replacing (RRP $2,050 plus labour, but with trade price servicing, down to $1,850 fitted) :eek:
Oh, and all spark plugs need to be replaced as they are fouledSo I asked had we tried the Veccy with new spark plugs first.... no, but they will just foul up again, came the reply. So humour me....new spark plugs in, and she is purring fine..... they said it won't last long.

Thoughts anyone :confused:

Again, this is sooo far out of my league :oI wouldn't replace the ECM until you've confirmed that replacing the spark plugs didn't fix the problem. Fault codes usually means that the ECM has detected a problem with something else, not that the ECM itself has a problem... did they tell you what the fault code(s) was, e.g. P0123?

[Tfer]

Whoever told you that is telling porkies - all Vectra Cs have fuel filters. If you check your owner's manual you'll find it's scheduled to be replaced every 60k km!

I wouldn't replace the ECM until you've confirmed that replacing the spark plugs didn't fix the problem. Fault codes usually means that the ECM has detected a problem with something else, not that the ECM itself has a problem... did they tell you what the fault code(s) was, e.g. P0123?

Well can only go by what Holden have told me.... and there is no mention of fuel filter being cleaned or replaced as per the work done in my first post.... but I shall take your word for it :)

I have asked for a list of fault codes, but what you say makes sense to me..... won't know now till Tuesday, as I am in Melbourne from tomorrow lunchtime, and so the Veccy stays at Holden for the long weekend. :o

[vectraguy01]

the fault codes are wats going to be for us determine wat the problem is, with the opel range the error codes that they tell us via tech 2 or via diagnostic tools dont always represent the problem, plus holden have no freakn clue on how our cars work, they only normaly work on the comodores the opel range to them is stupid so they cant understand everything the tech 2 is saying to them error code wise.
regarding the fuel filter every single car made from like 99 onwards has a fuel filter, they are just dumb arses if they cant find it.
id say that would be the issue (fuel filter or fuel pump)
And if u need a need ecu dont get it from holden buy it from overseas and save a packet.

[NXA-16H]

Have you checked the throttle body???

Last time I had issues with the Barina and rough idling, I had the throttle body blown-out with a high-pressure air blaster, and it was as right as rain afterwards.

Just my 2c. worth

Hope it helps.

NXK-43Y

[platypus]

yeah too many to mention - but first port of call would be fuel and fueling - new fuel filter would be my first start, followed by a run on E10 (or dump a litre of metho into the tank - why? because this will make any water in your tank miscible through the engine)

could the timing be out? that will cause this too!!

EGR valve broken will cause the fouling but not so much the idle issues...

finally if its still doing it check O2 sensor after that for same reason check the AFM (or MAF which does the veccy have?)

[rjastra]

have you checked both the EGR valve (and pipes!) and the PCV valve?

[Tfer]

the fault codes are wats going to be for us determine wat the problem is, with the opel range the error codes that they tell us via tech 2 or via diagnostic tools dont always represent the problem, plus holden have no freakn clue on how our cars work, they only normaly work on the comodores the opel range to them is stupid so they cant understand everything the tech 2 is saying to them error code wise.
regarding the fuel filter every single car made from like 99 onwards has a fuel filter, they are just dumb arses if they cant find it.
id say that would be the issue (fuel filter or fuel pump)
And if u need a need ecu dont get it from holden buy it from overseas and save a packet.

Thanks for your thoughts here..... okay error codes.... according to Holden they represent "misfire codes for all cylinders except cylinder 2"..... P0306, P0301, P0300, P0303. :confused:


Have you checked the throttle body???

Last time I had issues with the Barina and rough idling, I had the throttle body blown-out with a high-pressure air blaster, and it was as right as rain afterwards.

Just my 2c. worth

Hope it helps.

NXK-43Y

Thanks mate.... was cleaned recently... by me.... but she ran a whole lot better after.... so not sure if related. But, good point to raise :)


yeah too many to mention - but first port of call would be fuel and fueling - new fuel filter would be my first start, followed by a run on E10 (or dump a litre of metho into the tank - why? because this will make any water in your tank miscible through the engine)

could the timing be out? that will cause this too!!

EGR valve broken will cause the fouling but not so much the idle issues...

finally if its still doing it check O2 sensor after that for same reason check the AFM (or MAF which does the veccy have?)

Thanks!

Timing appears to be right according to Holden although they did muck around for a little bit with this. :o

Should no longer be water in the tank, as the tank was drained and cleaned.... but hadn't heard of the metho idea.... would it hurt to do this anyway? :confused:


have you checked both the EGR valve (and pipes!) and the PCV valve?

Sorry..... I have no idea what these are.... please explain. :confused:

[Tfer]

Holden replaced the spark plugs.... for this trail purpose, I asked for just the normal/standard ones to be put in (no use wasting platinum plugs if indeed they do foul), and I collected the old girl up yesterday lunchtime. :)

Late that afternoon, about 120kms later.... she had one of her moments.... rough idling, engine management light flashed on and off.... then righted herself.... :confused:

This morning.... another very brief episode.... and again righted herself.... I shall keep an eye on this till Monday and see what happens :rolleyes:

Thanks though to everyone who has provided me with valuable suggestions/ideas.... :)

[oneightoo]

are you taking it straight back to holden?

doesnt sound like they've actually fixed anything..

[rjastra]

EGR = exhaust gas recirculation. These valves and associated plumbing can gum up over time causing poor running and idling.

PCV = positive crankcase ventilation. Similar problems can occur especially lumpy idling

Both would probably cause an engine check light if they are faulty.

[vectraguy01]

the 2.6l and 3.2l v6 veccy's dont have a egr value, only other thing i can think it could be is the fuel pressure regulator.
Is it rough throughout the rev range or only at idle??
And have they changed the fuel filter or can they still not find it???

[platypus]

And have they changed the fuel filter or can they still not find it???

usual spots are just on side of petrol tank, under the sill,
above the wheel arch,
in the tank, via the under seat access - (this is best as its normally straight inline with the pump

the fuel gauge sender is the thing at the front of the tank... stupid GM caused me to lose 9 litres of premium yesterday by putting it there!!!

[Tfer]

Day 3...... the Veccy is still going well (touches wood), so fingers' crossed. Have given her till Monday..... added another 165kms with no dramas ;)

Will keep you posted :) and thanks again for the input :)

[oneightoo]

so i take it there we no prizes?

[SSS_Hoon]

try looking into the fuel pressure as with my SSS when my fuel reg was rooted and was up around the 4bar of fuel pressure now for a N/A that is way to high it would be like u described not exactly but similar to it.


SSS_Hoon

[vectraguy01]

the fpr is the veccy is a 3.8bar

[auzvectra]

P0300 - Engine Misfire Detected
P0301 - Cylinder 1 Misfire Detected
P0303 - Cylinder 3 Misfire Detected
P0306 - Cylinder 6 Misfire Detected

[Tfer]

P0300 - Engine Misfire Detected
P0301 - Cylinder 1 Misfire Detected
P0303 - Cylinder 3 Misfire Detected
P0306 - Cylinder 6 Misfire Detected

Thanks Matt, and seriously, thank you for allowing me to bounce ideas off you :cool:

So what do they mean.... apart from misfiring.... what do they mean... I mean what could cause this? :confused:

Well.....

The Veccy is officially dead... won't idle and is having a few issues starting (my rough guess are the spark plugs have fouled up again after 500km) :(

Luckily I have the use of R's AH Astra CDX to toodle around in.... yay, still in an Opel :) and so have I guess the luxury of taking my time here.... as frustrating as it is :o

So, someone has suggested I try this (and what do you all think?):

Remove the ECU
Remove the ignition security module
Send both and ignition key to Petroject in Nunawading for a diagnostic check (will cost for the check about $100)
They then put the ECU on their bench and convince it that it is sitting back in the Veccy, and check the ECU
They may be able to repair/recode if need beI thought this may be a good idea to eliminate once and for all the question hanging over the ECU ;)

Your thoughts?

[rjastra]

Did they replace the sparkplug leads? Or did i miss that?

[oneightoo]

hey if it's only $100 and it works, it's probably going to be the cheapest fix you'll ever encounter..

as they say, if you dont try, you'll never know..

give it a go thomas..

[btm]

give it a go thomas..
you can dooo it :D

[rusole21]

First i would pm bornwild. He knows everything. Then i would look at the Coil packs or leads, Weird that only some cylinders would misfire...
Also check the o2 sensor as someone else sugested. If this is screwed then the ecu will be dumping more fuel and could in turn screw your plugs. But yeah pm bornwild and you will be sorted!!

[xplosv57]

First i would pm bornwild. He knows everything. But yeah pm bornwild and you will be sorted!!

PLEASE tell me your joking???

Anyways, Thomas, can you list exactly what has been done by Holden from the day this stuff started to the point now where it has died.

Also what k's are on the car, cos i know you travel alot.

Try the ECU thing i guess, $100 is very cheap to eliminate it, much cheaper than a replacement!!

[platypus]

P0300 - Engine Misfire Detected
P0301 - Cylinder 1 Misfire Detected
P0303 - Cylinder 3 Misfire Detected
P0306 - Cylinder 6 Misfire Detected

umm isn't that one bank ... ie one entire side??

gee me thinks should be stepping back and looking at this problem as basics... like is there oil/water in the cylinder? is there pressure in said cylinders... check the timing still

that really rules the intake and exhaust out, as its one entire bank! also rules out pcv and egr

perhaps you have a failed gasket? or your timing as slipped a tooth

get someone to raise the revs in your car in neutral and check to see if its blowing smoke at all

[auzvectra]

no 1,3, and 5 would bt 1 bank, 1st thing i thought of ;).
otherwiese i would have said maybe coil pack.

[platypus]

no 1,3, and 5 would bt 1 bank, 1st thing i thought of

grr and doh!!

so simple yet so off the mark!!

still cylinder 6 could have just been a coincidence, depending on the firing order 2 sequential misses could help stall the third fire.. but alas for i'm clueless to that order!!

[stevedee3]

but alas for i'm clueless to that order!!Nice and simple: 1-2-3-4-5-6!

[Tfer]

Did they replace the sparkplug leads? Or did i miss that?

Leads not yet replaced


hey if it's only $100 and it works, it's probably going to be the cheapest fix you'll ever encounter..

as they say, if you dont try, you'll never know..

give it a go thomas..

Yes, indeed I shall..... ;)


you can dooo it :D

I know I can, I know I can..... have asked Matt (auzvectra) when he can make some time to remove the ECU and ignition module so that I can send it away. Now just waiting for Matt's time (and yes I am reimbursing him for time spent, and distance travelled) :)


First i would pm bornwild. He knows everything. Then i would look at the Coil packs or leads, Weird that only some cylinders would misfire...
Also check the o2 sensor as someone else sugested. If this is screwed then the ecu will be dumping more fuel and could in turn screw your plugs. But yeah pm bornwild and you will be sorted!!

See below :)


PLEASE tell me your joking???

Anyways, Thomas, can you list exactly what has been done by Holden from the day this stuff started to the point now where it has died.

Also what k's are on the car, cos i know you travel alot.

Try the ECU thing i guess, $100 is very cheap to eliminate it, much cheaper than a replacement!!

See below also :)


umm isn't that one bank ... ie one entire side??

gee me thinks should be stepping back and looking at this problem as basics... like is there oil/water in the cylinder? is there pressure in said cylinders... check the timing still

that really rules the intake and exhaust out, as its one entire bank! also rules out pcv and egr

perhaps you have a failed gasket? or your timing as slipped a tooth

get someone to raise the revs in your car in neutral and check to see if its blowing smoke at all

May get Matt to look at this.... well and truly beyond me :o


no 1,3, and 5 would bt 1 bank, 1st thing i thought of ;).
otherwiese i would have said maybe coil pack.


grr and doh!!

so simple yet so off the mark!!

still cylinder 6 could have just been a coincidence, depending on the firing order 2 sequential misses could help stall the third fire.. but alas for i'm clueless to that order!!

Say what :confused:


Nice and simple: 1-2-3-4-5-6!

Really? :confused:

Okay.... some of the more finer details and an update:

The Veccy is now 5 years old (build date 12/02) but was first registered 3/03 and has done 164,600km.
Holden has done the following:
Removed fuel tank and outsourced for draining and cleaning
Cleaned fuel system
Cleaned injectors (removed each one to clean)
Once the fuel system was back together, they found she was idling a little rough, and so fiddled around and got her idling smoothly (well, smoothly for a Veccy V6)
After about a week, the old symptons came back
Holden upon diagnosis, produced the 5 fault codes and said it was the ECU, and also said the plugs were fouled and needed replacing once the ECU was replaced.
Under my directions, Holden replaced the plugs (normal ones for now) and she ran smooth, apart from 2 little glitches (engine management light flickered on and off, rough idling, rough under load (not as much though as when at idling) ran for approximately 500km and then enough was enough.
It is believed the plugs are fouled up again (Holden said they would foul up almost immediately I drove her out the first time).Now what I am doing (my plan of attack thus far):

Ask auzvectra to remove ECU and ignition module and send these plus ignition key to Petroject in Nunawading Vic, which for about $100 they check the ECU (put it on some sort of wiring harness to convince the ECU that it is still in the Veccy).
If there are any ECU faults, Petroject will advise if these can be repaired (if so, may cost up to $400 or thereabouts)
ECU returned and Matt installs.
If ECU is found to be fine, then next step is to get the old girl (possibly place new plugs in first) to an EFI specialist and check out the fuel system, etc which appears to be where most people are headed.
Then we shall assess further.So in the meantime, I have detailed R's AH Astra which is now my day to day ride until further notice. Prior to just shelling out the dollars willy nilly, I want to go through the process of elimination. :o

The saga continues.............

[SSS_Hoon]

before u go and do any of that.

are your inj in a fuel rail that can be taken out of the car while its running?

As i would be looking there first as it sounds like one or more of the Inj could be leaking i had the problem with my SSS also after cleaning was done to them.

If u can undo the rail the Inj are in and take them out and see if they are leaking then turn the ign on so the fuel pump pressurizes the system and see if they are leaking there should be no fuel coming out at all.


SSS_Hoon

[Tfer]

before u go and do any of that.

are your inj in a fuel rail that can be taken out of the car while its running?

As i would be looking there first as it sounds like one or more of the Inj could be leaking i had the problem with my SSS also after cleaning was done to them.

If u can undo the rail the Inj are in and take them out and see if they are leaking then turn the ign on so the fuel pump pressurizes the system and see if they are leaking there should be no fuel coming out at all.


SSS_Hoon

Good point, but I really have no idea as to how I would do this. :o

I will ask for auzvectra's extra further assistance here..... and thank you for your suggestion SSS_Hoon :)

[SSS_Hoon]

Good point, but I really have no idea as to how I would do this. :o

I will ask for auzvectra's extra further assistance here..... and thank you for your suggestion SSS_Hoon :)

no worries.

SSS_Hoon

[auzvectra]

although if the 3.2L's manifold is anything like the 2.6L's, that would not be an easy thing to do ;).
although i love those clips, so quick to take off and on :).

[Tfer]

although if the 3.2L's manifold is anything like the 2.6L's, that would not be an easy thing to do ;).
although i love those clips, so quick to take off and on :).

So..... when can you help me out? :confused:

[Tfer]

Matt's coming on Sunday to remove the ECU and ignition module :dance:

[rusole21]

PLEASE tell me your joking???


Na man havent you seen everything bornwild says is on the mark? haha yes i am trully joking!

I just think its funny how he will try to tell ya something and argue with ya but when it comes to threads like these where people are being asked for advice he goes running. NOOB!!!

[Tfer]

Na man havent you seen everything bornwild says is on the mark? haha yes i am trully joking!

I just think its funny how he will try to tell ya something and argue with ya but when it comes to threads like these where people are being asked for advice he goes running. NOOB!!!

Some of the things he does say are accurate and correct though ;)

[rusole21]

Pretty hard not to get it right sometimes

[reedaaron]

google is your friend ;)

[Tfer]

Pretty hard not to get it right sometimes

That is true.... even I can get it right sometimes :p :D


google is your friend ;)

Shhhhhhhhhh................ :p :rolleyes: :)

[vectraguy01]

although if the 3.2L's manifold is anything like the 2.6L's, that would not be an easy thing to do ;).
although i love those clips, so quick to take off and on :).

those clips are really quite quick to release and get them off

[Tfer]

Okay.... thanks to auzvectra and vectraguy01 (and I think they both learnt a few new things), the ECU and ignition module has been removed and will be sent to Petroject in Vic today. :)

The ignition module was not a separate removable item as per the Astra G's or Veccy B's but rather formed a part of the control unit wrapped around the steering column (the pictures will explain).

So the Veccy C is now sitting at R's without the steering wheel in place (had to be removed to remove the ignition module).

So now the wait.......

http://img524.imageshack.us/img524/5168/img00172uf2.jpg

http://img177.imageshack.us/img177/2034/img00173ve6.jpg

[stevedee3]

The ignition module was not a separate removable item as per the Astra G's or Veccy B's but rather formed a part of the control unit wrapped around the steering column (the pictures will explain).


http://img524.imageshack.us/img524/5168/img00172uf2.jpg


The thing you have called an ignition module is the CIM (Column integrated Module) - it controls the key authentication and is also the gateway between the high and low speed CAN buses. It also contains the steering angle sensor used by the ESP system. So there's plenty of important stuff in there.

I'd assumed you meant the spark plug module when referring to the ignition module...

[auzvectra]

he would have meant the immobiliser module ;).

[vectraguy01]

yer it take quite abit to get the airbag out of the steering wheel though.

[auzvectra]

yer it take quite abit to get the airbag out of the steering wheel though.

only cause we were flying blind with the clips from behind :(.
now it would only take 10 secs to get out ;).

[Tfer]

he would have meant the immobiliser module ;).

That's the one! :o


yer it take quite abit to get the airbag out of the steering wheel though.

I couldn't bear to watch :rolleyes:


only cause we were flying blind with the clips from behind :(.
now it would only take 10 secs to get out ;).

Good job..... and thank you again!:angel:

The parts should be in Melbourne now.... just waiting on the call to confirm arrival :)

[Tfer]

Update on the Veccy....

Should hopefully have an update on the ECU Monday (waiting on an engineer from Opel to return to work, to assist Petroject with some encryption issues)
If there is a problem with ECU, they said 2 -3 days to recode, fix, whatever it is they do and then an overnight return.
If no problem with ECU, then overnight return of ECU
ECU et al to be reinstalled into Veccy and then off to an injection specialist on the Gold Coast:(

So, she is still a work in progress :(

[auzvectra]

(nudges tfer) while the ecu's getting programmed ;);).
that is if they can read and write to that section of the ecu :D.

[Tfer]

(nudges tfer) while the ecu's getting programmed ;);).
that is if they can read and write to that section of the ecu :D.

Good call Matt ;)

At this stage they are having a few "issues" with the immobiliser something or rather in the steering column stuff we sent them.... awaiting on some info from Opel to bypass :rolleyes:

[vectraguy01]

hope its back on the road soon!

[Tfer]

hope its back on the road soon!

Me too...... :o

Update time again..... Sam from Petroject is having some issues with getting around the Veccy's immobiliser, has ground to a halt, as cannot get the ECU to run properly on the bench. Luckily, Auzvectra is trying to assist here by procuring a wiring diagram for the Veccy C so that they can work out what "wattage" is required where.... thanks Matt :cool:

Slow progress

[vectraguy01]

dame that sucks, I wouldnt mind having a go againist ur car tfer when its back on the road, i think we both might be quite surprised. (down the quarter of course) :P

[Tfer]

Petroject get their hands on a wiring diagram for the Veccy C, so that they can bypass the immobiliser.... :(

So have a couple of very kind hearted souls on the hunt.... hoping to achieve something positive by the end of the weekend. ;)

Meanwhile.... have posted the problem on Vectra-C.com (UK Forum for Veccy C's, D's and Signums) and here's one of the responses......

"you can get a fuel sample from the valv on the fuel rail, if you have the correct equipment to do so, that will tell you if the fuel is clean or not..

Fouling plugs suggests a very rich mix, so i'd be interested in what holden have done to 'get it running'. they always run rich for the first couple of minutes while on 'cold start' but it shouldn't foul the plugs..

the misfire codes are more than likely being generated by the fouled plugs and their inabilty to ignite an overrich mixture..

Unless something very tragic has happened, i also find it hard to see how incorrect fuel can damage an electronic component.. that is usually the result of voltage spike or incorrect wiring..It does need testing, but i still fail to see how it doesn't work, if holden have managed to extract fault codes from it, if you see what i mean..http://forum.vectra-c.com/images/smilies/wink.gif..

i don't know what the conversion rates are £GBP/$AUS at the mo, but an ECU for your car over here costs £316.54+Tax ( £371.94 all in)..

If it's cheaper than holden or you can source one, then i'll happily obtain one for you.."

This is from one of our Mods..... the dollars equates to $830AUD..... hmmm :rolleyes:

[auzvectra]

bit cheaper then holdens quote isnt it.
and add shipping, and $100 for holden to program it.

[Tfer]

bit cheaper then holdens quote isnt it.
and add shipping, and $100 for holden to program it.

Certainly makes it far more attractive than what Holden can do. Hopefully though, won't be needed....... ;)

Update....

Provided Petroject with the following link:

https://opel-tis.eur.gm.com/imtportal

Which should help them obtain their wiring diagram.... thanks stevedee3 :cool:

[rjastra]

Sell the car....

[Tfer]

Sell the car....

Ummm.... no.

If you don't have a constructive comment... leave it out of this thread... thanks.

[vectraguy01]

Sell the car....

Get real Rjastra, leave it out. If you want to post crap do it in the other threads not here.

We all want it fixed, hope all goes well with it Tfer can't wait to see it back on the road.

[Tfer]

Get real Rjastra, leave it out. If you want to post crap do it in the other threads not here.

We all want it fixed, hope all goes well with it Tfer can't wait to see it back on the road.

We do indeed..... shall give you a drive, so you can compare to yours :D

[vectraguy01]

awesome, like to feel the difference in drive quality and power, n see if mines quicker lol hehe :P

[jsantos]

all i can possibly suggest is the fuel pump or throttle, both have probably already been said.

And if was to try thinking out of the box a bit perhaps it's two problems, one of which is the clutch is some how ****ing up? I know it's unlikely etc just trying to think of a possible thing that could cause some of the symptoms.

"

Lack of power (feels much less powerful than a 1.8l auto AH Astra, one of which I drive regularly... and no criticism intended) (possibly slipping?)
Engine will sometimes just die.... mostly when coming to a stop, but will start easily. ( possibly stalling?)"my other "extremely unlikley but throwing it out there" comments are

Could it be a heat or lubrication problem perhaps? the cv joints? Added resistence to the engine from broken cv joints or something?

[vectraguy01]

dont think it would be the clutch, as when u depress it you would know if it has a problem pushing it down or even enaging gears, my clutch is stuffed, it vibrates alot so its in the process of eventually dying.

[Tfer]

all i can possibly suggest is the fuel pump or throttle, both have probably already been said.

And if was to try thinking out of the box a bit perhaps it's two problems, one of which is the clutch is some how ****ing up? I know it's unlikely etc just trying to think of a possible thing that could cause some of the symptoms.

"

Lack of power (feels much less powerful than a 1.8l auto AH Astra, one of which I drive regularly... and no criticism intended) (possibly slipping?)
Engine will sometimes just die.... mostly when coming to a stop, but will start easily. ( possibly stalling?)"my other "extremely unlikley but throwing it out there" comments are

Could it be a heat or lubrication problem perhaps? the cv joints? Added resistence to the engine from broken cv joints or something?

Good thoughts.....

Clutch appeared to be fine, and wasn't slipping. Not sure about the other stuff.

Just paid $150 for a wiring diagram for the Veccy C.... will have the results on the ECU by Tuesday ;)

[auzvectra]

so they went for the link option hey, howd they go with it, get the info alright?

[poita]

fingers crossed for ya mate.
i really hope all turns out well, its been such a long process.

[xplosv57]

fingers crossed for ya mate.
i really hope all turns out well, its been such a long process.

Ditto, hope it all gets done soon, and i'm glad it hasn't put you off your Veccy experience, i know if i was in the same situation i wouldn't have as calm or rational!!!! :D

[poita]

thomas doesnt do angry
he does calm rational thought processed type stuff

[Tfer]

so they went for the link option hey, howd they go with it, get the info alright?

Apparently dowloading the information either yesterday last thing or Tuesday..... I will ask them for a copy of the wiring diagrams and give them to PaulyJ to post onto Opelaus for future reference for our members. :)


fingers crossed for ya mate.
i really hope all turns out well, its been such a long process.

Hell yes.... me too.... sat down next to the Veccy yesterday (sitting down the side of the house under a blue car cover) and wondered if ever the old girl will fire up again :(


Ditto, hope it all gets done soon, and i'm glad it hasn't put you off your Veccy experience, i know if i was in the same situation i wouldn't have as calm or rational!!!! :D

When she is working, she works wonderfully well, and really for the money they are worth these days, she is most excellent value for money.... this experience has been, well, painful, but I believe Holden are wrong, and so have to now prove that, and back what I believe..... hell, cannot get upset, as it is sort of my decision to go this path :rolleyes:


thomas doesnt do angry
he does calm rational thought processed type stuff

Getting to the end of my tether slowly though.... when all this is done, I will then post my "review" on the Astra AH CDX auto.... hopefully won't be boring. I have almost forgotten what power feels like :rolleyes:

Thanks for your kind words all..... it is a journey for sure.... :)

[Tfer]

Update....

The previous link did not work as it can only be used by people in Europe, but it did instill some drive into Petroject and they have since scoured the internet and found some files which they are now in the process of downloading and uncompressing...... they have asked to the end of the week.

What else could I say.... at least they now have a determination about them ;)

Stood out in the rain this morning and stared at my Veccy sitting under her car cover..... bugger I miss the old girl :(

[reedaaron]

i feel for you Thomas... i'm without my car at the moment and it kinda sucks... no doubt nowhere near as bad as you not having the Veccy...cos it's such a nice car..and you've been without it for too long now..

hope they get it sorted for you soon.

[Tfer]

i feel for you Thomas... i'm without my car at the moment and it kinda sucks... no doubt nowhere near as bad as you not having the Veccy...cos it's such a nice car..and you've been without it for too long now..

hope they get it sorted for you soon.

Thanks mate... it does generally suck big time, but I am very thankful for the unlimited use of R's Astra.... speaking of which, I am up for the 30,000km service soon.... its the least I can do for her :)

[Wraith]

fingers crossed for ya mate.
i really hope all turns out well, its been such a long process.

Ditto +2

Hope all turns out well and good soon for you Thomas...

[Tfer]

Update time again....

Well, I am sure no one on the site knows this little piece of Veccy C trivia, and if you did, don't tell me, as I have just wasted 2 months of waiting..... for nothing :(

Today Petroject informed me they had successfully downloaded the Veccy C wiring diagrams and were ready to go forward, until...... they found a little bit of extra information. The Veccy C's have 7 extra modules throughout the car that when the key is turned in the ignition, receive cryptic codes, and if one does not correctly respond, the Veccy C does not start. This cannot be duplicated on a bench. :(

Anyway everything is back on its way to Brisbane..... but......

Spoke at length to Sam at Petroject who really also was getting rather peeved that he wasn't making any progress, and he feels the following:

ECU is not know to be a problem area for the Veccy C
ECU would pick up faults from other things not itself
If it was a misfire on one cylinder it would certainly be a good chance it is an ECU problem
Being a misfire on 5 out of the 6 cylinders indicate a fuel / air problem
Fouling plugs after 500 kms indicates mixture is too rich, which itself lends itself to the theory that the air flow sensor (or something) is either worn or needs adjusting, as it is not giving the correct readings, and therefore effecting the amount of pulses of fuel from the injectors.So auzvectra and vectraguy01 are going to reinstall everything, put new plugs in and with a little bit of luck, swap over vectraguy01's air sensor thingy and see what that does initially. Thanks for the conversation today Matt and your continued input (and Chris) :)

(apologies if I got any of this wrong)

May yet be a simple fix......................................

[xplosv57]

I hope it is a simple fix and the Veccy is back on the road quick smart!!!

Good luck!!

[Tfer]

Update.....

Last Saturday, auzvectra, vectraguy01 and a mate installed the ECU, the steering column controls etc and the steering wheel (nut still needs to be tensioned) and the airbag still to go on.

Holden mobile mechanic is coming on Monday to replace the sparkplugs (expensive but not many out there are keen to tackle a Veccy due to what needs to be done to get at the plugs).

After this.... the guys attack the air flow meter if I am not mistaken ;)

[ope126]

Update.....

Last Saturday, auzvectra, vectraguy01 and a mate installed the ECU, the steering column controls etc and the steering wheel (nut still needs to be tensioned) and the airbag still to go on.

Holden mobile mechanic is coming on Monday to replace the sparkplugs (expensive but not many out there are keen to tackle a Veccy due to what needs to be done to get at the plugs).

After this.... the guys attack the air flow meter if I am not mistaken ;)


Keep us informed Thomas...

[auzvectra]

yeah, not many cars need to take the complete intake manifold off to change the sparky's :(.

[Tfer]

Things which haven't been tested (to my knowledge):

Fuel pressure regulator
O2 Sensor
Air Flow Meter
Fuel Pump
An injector leakingSo from all of these, which ones do we think are most likely the culprit.

A Holden mobile mechanic is here on Monday to replace the spark plugs, so I wonder if they can check any of these easily and eliminate them from the problems?

Thanks again all for your inputs.... it certainly is a journey. :o

[xplosv57]

Things which haven't been tested (to my knowledge):

Fuel pressure regulator
O2 Sensor
Air Flow Meter
Fuel Pump
Leads
An injector leaking

Are you sure they haven't been checked, cause some of those things should have been checked before the ECU was removed!!!

The Holden guy should be able to diagnose and rule out those parts for failure, but i guess that would cost more for you for his time!!!

[shoey85]

Things which haven't been tested (to my knowledge):

Fuel pressure regulator
O2 Sensor
Air Flow Meter
Fuel Pump
Leads
An injector leakingSo from all of these, which ones do we think are most likely the culprit.

A Holden mobile mechanic is here on Monday to replace the spark plugs, so I wonder if they can check any of these easily and eliminate them from the problems?

Thanks again all for your inputs.... it certainly is a journey. :o


well you can cross out the Leads as the v6 veccy has individual coil packs on the spark plugs. so youd be checking the wiring harness.

[vectraguy01]

once we tighten up the steering nut, then we can start it and see wat the problem is n try n diagnose it before holden does, will try atleast.

[Tfer]

Are you sure they haven't been checked, cause some of those things should have been checked before the ECU was removed!!!

The Holden guy should be able to diagnose and rule out those parts for failure, but i guess that would cost more for you for his time!!!

Hmmm if I am not mistaken the previous Holden dealership focussed solely on the ECU, and the ECU only (apart from draining and cleaning the fuel tank, lines and each individual injector). Good to know.... its about time the old girl is back on the road :o


well you can cross out the Leads as the v6 veccy has individual coil packs on the spark plugs. so youd be checking the wiring harness.

Sweet as shoey.... modified the list... thanks :)

I think we have discounted the coil packs due to misfires in just not one bank of cylinders? :confused:


once we tighten up the steering nut, then we can start it and see wat the problem is n try n diagnose it before holden does, will try atleast.

Your mission... should you choose to accept it.... is....

Get my Veccy going sweetly (well as sweetly as a Veccy C can) again.... please :rolleyes:

[Keep'emRunning]

without reading the thread in it's entirety.. Why are the electrics now under suspicion when it was originally fuel related?

What engine.. the Z32?

Have you checked the knock sensor? Might explain the intermittent ecu light and running problems...

[Tfer]

without reading the thread in it's entirety.. Why are the electrics now under suspicion when it was originally fuel related?

What engine.. the Z32?

Have you checked the knock sensor? Might explain the intermittent ecu light and running problems...

Well not actually sure it was fuel related to start with.... as not that trusting of what the original Holden Dealership diagnosed.

However, not being mechanically minded, it would seem from consensus the Veccy C's fuel mixture (yes, a 3.2l) is running rich, and this very thing may in fact be the cause of the plugs fouling.

Again, from a number of people and one company is the train of thought the air flow meter or the O2 sensor (these to me sound very similar :confused: ) is either in need of adjusting or replacing (giving the ECU wrong signals, hence injectors pulsing too often, leading to too much fuel.... ie. running rich)

I hope I got this right.... and this is the reason for the checking of the O2 sensors and airflow meter, amongst other things.... guess you would call it the process of elimination.

:)

[Tfer]

As for the knock sensor.... not actually sure what that does or what the effects could be.... could you be a little more specific?

Thanks for your input though :)

[Tfer]

Okay here's an interesting update, and not sure about it, but may entertain the idea....

Received a call from the Fleet Manager from the Holden Dealership that was to be coming on Monday to replace the spark plugs and he:

Wants RACQ to come collect the Veccy (no cost under breakdown)
Have a full lot of diagnosis programs run
Ascertain exactly what the problems are
Give me fleet discount on parts and labour
Check to ensure the Veccy has all the previous and latest updates etc from Vauxhall (he believes other dealerships would never have done this) and thinks this may have something to do with the problem
Believes if it is the ECU in most cases an ECU can be reprogrammed/recoded/repaired and not replaced
Seeing as Holden Dealerships have serviced the Veccy from new, get Holden to chip in with some potential repair costs
Wants the Veccy MondaySo is he my fairy godmother? I am a trusting person normally, but this all sounds too good to be true........

What are your thoughts?

[shoey85]

Okay here's an interesting update, and not sure about it, but may entertain the idea....

Received a call from the Fleet Manager from the Holden Dealership that was to be coming on Monday to replace the spark plugs and he:

Wants RACQ to come collect the Veccy (no cost under breakdown)
Have a full lot of diagnosis programs run
Ascertain exactly what the problems are
Give me fleet discount on parts and labour
Check to ensure the Veccy has all the previous and latest updates etc from Vauxhall (he believes other dealerships would never have done this) and thinks this may have something to do with the problem
Believes if it is the ECU in most cases an ECU can be reprogrammed/recoded/repaired and not replaced
Seeing as Holden Dealerships have serviced the Veccy from new, get Holden to chip in with some potential repair costs
Wants the Veccy MondaySo is he my fairy godmother? I am a trusting person normally, but this all sounds too good to be true........

What are your thoughts?


did you get his name, quote it contantly when talking to Holdens Service Plebs

[USC]

Sell the car....
agree...its not worth making your life hell.

[stevedee3]

So is he my fairy godmother? I am a trusting person normally, but this all sounds too good to be true........I think this is probably what you should have received in the first place... maybe this guy is embarrassed at the service his dealership has given you so far and wants to try and fix the problem.

[poita]

USC that won't happen.


Thomas yes it does sound to good to be true.
But honestly mate, what do you have to lose?
the car is off the road and u cant drive it anyway

[stevedee3]

...air flow meter or the O2 sensor (these to me sound very similar :confused: )The air flow meter measures the amount of air going into the engine. O2 sensors measure the amount of oxygen in the exhaust gases. There's two before the catalytic converters to control the fuel/air mixture, and two after the cats to verify that they're working properly.


As for the knock sensor.... not actually sure what that does or what the effects could be...Knock sensors sense knocking (vibration due to rough combustion).

[USC]

is it possible to test all wiring harness in the engine bay (ie from sensors to ECU)??
what codes does the ECU give?
my mate`s nissan primera was running rough, stalling at lights. It ended up being the air flow sensor (after numerous diagnosis by nissan). His alternator also needed replacing as it died a couple of weeks after the sensor was replaced. not sure how relevant this is but it might help.

o2 sensors wont make the engine stall or run really badly (they are attached to the exhaust and measure the amount of unburnt fuel in the exhaust to help the ECU adjust the petrol/air mixture).if o2 sensors arent working, car will just run a bit richer but not rough. does the vectra have knock sensors? I thought only turbos have them but i might be wrong. knock sensor and crank angle sensor might be worth checking.

I dont think its the Injectors(otherwise, it would be hard to start engine also, might want to do a spray pattern test but I seriously doubt they are faulty), cant be faulty ECU, cant be o2 sensors, if u have tested sparks and timing then u can rule out spark plugs, coil packs and spark plug wiring.

I would bet my money on your air flow meter/air temp. sensor mate. the air flow meter controls both the amount of air going into your engine as well as amount of petrol ECU will send to injectors. If the sensor is faulty, it will fool the car into thinking that its running too rich, hence roughness when you are trying to drive hard as engine is not getting enough petrol, which might cause stalling at lights too.

[Keep'emRunning]

yep the 3.2 has knock sensors, one under each bank. If they are faulty, ignition timing is retarded, leading to poor running and lack of power.

Unlikely they would fail though as these things are probably the most reliable thing on the whole car.... :)

Unfortunately the ecu uses can bus to talk to the various other modules/sensors & it's a pita to diagnose without the proper tools.. unfortunately a dealership with a cluey tech is probably the only hope.

If there's no misfire, and plugs are simply being fouled, MAF could be the culprit as USC suggested, followed by the o2's and coolant sensor. The dealer should be able to do a r/t diag and know straight away. Let us know!

[Tfer]

agree...its not worth making your life hell.

I was going to say **** off, but then I read your next post, and I will now simply say, the Veccy is not going to be sold..... I do have plans for the old girl, and so she is with me for the long haul..... :)


I think this is probably what you should have received in the first place... maybe this guy is embarrassed at the service his dealership has given you so far and wants to try and fix the problem.

But different dealership to the one originally which is the bit I don't quite understand, and maybe I am not used to good Holden service either .... maybe he is looking for some positive press about his dealership?..... :)


USC that won't happen.


Thomas yes it does sound to good to be true.
But honestly mate, what do you have to lose?
the car is off the road and u cant drive it anyway

Email sent to the dealership asking if it is okay to have the Veccy trucked to their fleet service Monday morning..... you are right Peter, nothing to lose here. :)


The air flow meter measures the amount of air going into the engine. O2 sensors measure the amount of oxygen in the exhaust gases. There's two before the catalytic converters to control the fuel/air mixture, and two after the cats to verify that they're working properly.

Knock sensors sense knocking (vibration due to rough combustion).

Thanks stevedee3.... I know I don't know much about the mechanical aspect of the Veccy, so I thank you for your clear explanations :)


is it possible to test all wiring harness in the engine bay (ie from sensors to ECU)??
what codes does the ECU give?
my mate`s nissan primera was running rough, stalling at lights. It ended up being the air flow sensor (after numerous diagnosis by nissan). His alternator also needed replacing as it died a couple of weeks after the sensor was replaced. not sure how relevant this is but it might help.

o2 sensors wont make the engine stall or run really badly (they are attached to the exhaust and measure the amount of unburnt fuel in the exhaust to help the ECU adjust the petrol/air mixture).if o2 sensors arent working, car will just run a bit richer but not rough. does the vectra have knock sensors? I thought only turbos have them but i might be wrong. knock sensor and crank angle sensor might be worth checking.

I dont think its the Injectors(otherwise, it would be hard to start engine also, might want to do a spray pattern test but I seriously doubt they are faulty), cant be faulty ECU, cant be o2 sensors, if u have tested sparks and timing then u can rule out spark plugs, coil packs and spark plug wiring.

I would bet my money on your air flow meter/air temp. sensor mate. the air flow meter controls both the amount of air going into your engine as well as amount of petrol ECU will send to injectors. If the sensor is faulty, it will fool the car into thinking that its running too rich, hence roughness when you are trying to drive hard as engine is not getting enough petrol, which might cause stalling at lights too.

Thanks USC, this is what vectraguy01 and auzvectra, and Petroject are placing their money on also.... the airflow meter, mainly due to the the fouling of the plugs from a too rich fuel mixture (not tested yet, but assumed).:)


yep the 3.2 has knock sensors, one under each bank. If they are faulty, ignition timing is retarded, leading to poor running and lack of power.

Unlikely they would fail though as these things are probably the most reliable thing on the whole car.... :)

Unfortunately the ecu uses can bus to talk to the various other modules/sensors & it's a pita to diagnose without the proper tools.. unfortunately a dealership with a cluey tech is probably the only hope.

If there's no misfire, and plugs are simply being fouled, MAF could be the culprit as USC suggested, followed by the o2's and coolant sensor. The dealer should be able to do a r/t diag and know straight away. Let us know!

Hopefully some more feedback on Monday/Tuesday when the old girl is being diagnosed by Holden.... and if the service and assistance by this dealership are good, I will literally tell everyone and spread the good word.:D

Thank you to all who have shown an interest here and contributed... as for the Veccy, she is hanging around (I have plans for the old girl), and we will just keep updating R's AH Astra CDX (this is my day to day driver whilst the Veccy has been off the road for the past 2 months):angel:

[Tfer]

did you get his name, quote it contantly when talking to Holdens Service Plebs

Surely did ;)

Name
Mobile number
Email address
Direct line:D

[USC]

I was going to say **** off, but then I read your next post, and I will now simply say, the Veccy is not going to be sold..... I do have plans for the old girl, and so she is with me for the long haul..... :)


:p ....I was in a give up mood on that day.... :p u know one of those bad days...

Hope she gets well soon!! keep us updated!

[Tfer]

:p ....I was in a give up mood on that day.... :p u know one of those bad days...

Hope she gets well soon!! keep us updated!

thanks mate.... will surely do.... once she is on the road agian, I am sure you will hear my woop for joy from there :D

[vectraguy01]

testing air flow sensor on sat then shall see how it goes atleast.

[vectraguy01]

Ok well have just been at tfer's place, have put the steering wheel back on and it lives yay, once we fired it up we heard a knocking noise coming from the engine, seemed to be from where the timing belt and gears are.
Went for a quick burn first off.
Still was stalling and engine light was flashing then going off, rough idle.

Have put his maf sensor on my car, went for a burn with no issues at all, so the air flow meter is fine.

Put his maf back on his and went for another burn, does have a rough idle but is not due to the maf sensor at all, disconnected the maf sensor and took it for a drive, stumbled alittle at about 5grand then was fine, no engine light on with having maf disconnected. A few times when revving it out the car and engine would shake, then stop and then it would stall.

Also traction control and abs are fully disabled not working at all, traction light is on, and wont go off, have turned off car a few times to think it would reset it but that didnt work either.

Possible causes?
Fuel pressure regulator/ lines under inlet manifold with could be crushed as that was the issue with mine (but cant get to them without taking off inlet manifold to check)
Timing belt or gears.
Knock sensors.

Tfer is able to drive it, i suggested him taking it out for a longer drive to see the ecu try and work out the problems and bring up fault codes for holden to check out.
Tfer will take it to Holden on Monday for them to look into it further.

[Tfer]

Ok well have just been at tfer's place, have put the steering wheel back on and it lives yay, once we fired it up we heard a knocking noise coming from the engine, seemed to be from where the timing belt and gears are.
Went for a quick burn first off.
Still was stalling and engine light was flashing then going off, rough idle.

Have put his maf sensor on my car, went for a burn with no issues at all, so the air flow meter is fine.

Put his maf back on his and went for another burn, does have a rough idle but is not due to the maf sensor at all, disconnected the maf sensor and took it for a drive, stumbled alittle at about 5grand then was fine, no engine light on with having maf disconnected. A few times when revving it out the car and engine would shake, then stop and then it would stall.

Also traction control and abs are fully disabled not working at all, traction light is on, and wont go off, have turned off car a few times to think it would reset it but that didnt work either.

Possible causes?
Fuel pressure regulator/ lines under inlet manifold with could be crushed as that was the issue with mine (but cant get to them without taking off inlet manifold to check)
Timing belt or gears.
Knock sensors.

Tfer is able to drive it, i suggested him taking it out for a longer drive to see the ecu try and work out the problems and bring up fault codes for holden to check out.
Tfer will take it to Holden on Monday for them to look into it further.

Thanks Chris..... really appreciated your time today.

So, any thoughts all? :)

[Keep'emRunning]

..interesting about the TC and ABS.

Is it blowing any black smoke?

[Tfer]

..interesting about the TC and ABS.

Is it blowing any black smoke?

Its been an ongoing thing ever since I had her.... Holden have never been able to fix it, but normally goes away.... seems to be on for good atm. :(

As for black smoke.... not from what I have seen. Just detailed her, seeing as she is out from her car cover..... and the exhaust tips were actually reasonably clean.

[USC]

i am sure the technicians at holden will be able to diagnose something. ask for a professional mechanic to have a look at it.

[Tfer]

i am sure the technicians at holden will be able to diagnose something. ask for a professional mechanic to have a look at it.

Yeah the guy who will be overseeing the work has worked for Holden for the past 19.5 years and is know as Mr Fixit :)

UPDATE.....

Drove the Veccy to the Holden Dealership this morning..... 9.5kms of absolutely no problems whatsoever...... bloody Murphy's Law and O'Toole's Law rolled into one :rolleyes: but Traction Control light still ablaze :confused:

She is in the hands of Holden now.....

[vectraguy01]

thats really weriod, so didnt have a rough idle of anything, geez thats really weriod, atleast its with the fixit guy now, hopefully he can find the issue, keep us informed!

[auzvectra]

now every1 keep their fingers crossed :).

[Tfer]

Update.....

Spoke to the Holden Dealership today.... the Veccy, well, the old girl gave up her soul today, and 32, yes 32, fault codes were revealed. :eek:

Now haven't received the list, so not sure what has been found yet.

And not sure if these relate back since 2003.... it would appear she has never ever received any updates.

Time will tell, but at least they are taking this very seriously. :)

[ope126]

Update.....

Spoke to the Holden Dealership today.... the Veccy, well, the old girl gave up her soul today, and 32, yes 32, fault codes were revealed. :eek:

Now haven't received the list, so not sure what has been found yet.

And not sure if these relate back since 2003.... it would appear she has never ever received any updates.

Time will tell, but at least they are taking this very seriously. :)

Mate, that is crazy...

Keep us up to date...

[Tfer]

Mate, that is crazy...

Keep us up to date...

Yep surely is..... tehe, 10 per litre :rolleyes:

[poita]

wow thomas, just wow!
good to see things moving along.
kepp us all informed mate

[Tfer]

wow thomas, just wow!
good to see things moving along.
kepp us all informed mate

Makes you wonder if anything actually is working :rolleyes:

[vectraguy01]

and if mine is working correctly as well, u should mention to them that u have a mate with a veccy b, that needs checks done on it as well as it doesnt communicate with matts diagnositic tools

[auzvectra]

well it did, but all of a sudden now it doesnt. and thats all the tools too.

[Tfer]

and if mine is working correctly as well, u should mention to them that u have a mate with a veccy b, that needs checks done on it as well as it doesnt communicate with matts diagnositic tools


well it did, but all of a sudden now it doesnt. and thats all the tools too.

Interesting that you two mention that the car doesn't talk to the Tech 2..... this has just occurred to the Veccy and Holden's Tech 2 Dig Tool.... she has decided to zipper up :rolleyes:

They have reduced fault codes to 4.... all of which appear relevant, and now the work begins.

Still not aware of what they are etc, but will have a list sometime soon.

As for price, they have advised very fair. So am happy with progress thus far. ;)

[vectraguy01]

well thats great to hear! hope she will be better than eva back on the road very shortly.

[Tfer]

well thats great to hear! hope she will be better than eva back on the road very shortly.

You and me both Chris :angel:

[auzvectra]

dont forget me too ;).
then u'll have to bring it down to the spit on a sunday, it prob forgets what it looks like :).

[poita]

bugger the spit, we all forget wat it looks like!

[Tfer]

dont forget me too ;).
then u'll have to bring it down to the spit on a sunday, it prob forgets what it looks like :).

Thanks Matt.... you are not forgotten! :D


bugger the spit, we all forget wat it looks like!

I know.... when I drove it for the first time in 2 months..... it was like wow.... so different :rolleyes:


Update.... nothing to report today :(

[Tfer]

Update.....

Vectra should be back in my hands by end of next week, all being good :rolleyes:

Timing belt is also being looked into as there is a noise from that area (as vectraguy01 has quite rightly pointed out previously). Kms done 164,400 and timing belt is due to be replaced at 180,000km.

Holden are concentrating on eliminating 4 fault codes that are most likely causing some of, if not all of, the issues.

Will know more early next week....... ;)

[poita]

:)
i get a little excited everytime i see a new post in this thread
hoping thats its alive again.
great to see its only four codes now
here's hopin

[Tfer]

:)
i get a little excited everytime i see a new post in this thread
hoping thats its alive again.
great to see its only four codes now
here's hopin

I just want the old girl back :D

[Wraith]

Wow, this one's been taking a while for you now Thomas, as Poita's said, hope it all comes good for you SOON..... :)

[DirtyHarry]

you know in the end it going to come down to some silly little component.

[Tfer]

you know in the end it going to come down to some silly little component.

I do now....... :rolleyes:

UPDATE.....

After spending $475 in labour on the Veccy, the Holden dealership have gotten rid of all 32 fault codes, and the majority of these (28 in fact) were due to previous Holden dealerships not doing their jobs properly, and installing software upgrades etc as Opel/Vauxhall send them out. In this dealership's case, they get their updates from Vauxhall.

So, almost 2 weeks later, all fault codes are gone, and the following has been found:

Leaking/malformed gaskets for the air intake manifold
One injector leaking
Timing belt tapping the casing (they are not concerned about this and have suggested leave it go to the 180,000km service whereby it is replaced)They believe that both the leaking gasket for the air intake manifold plus the leaking injector will be the causes of the misfire...... fingers crossed :angel:

Some of the more interesting fault codes were (I do not have the complete list yet):

Engine misfire
Mulitiple cylinder misfire
Coolant temperature
Airflow temperatureThe process now:

Mobile injector specialist coming to retest the injectors (previously done by the other Holden dealership, but why would I trust them.... afterall they told me I needed a new ECU)
New air intake manifold (the Veccy C has to have a new one, and not just the gaskets replaced
New spark plugs
Fill the tank up
Road test
Head mechanic takes her home for a long drive both ways, and overnight (insurance up to date.... check)
Hopefully sorted....Waiting on prices for air intake manifold (gee, I hope this is what he said it was... if not, I apologise for the bum steer all), and result of injector test.

Anyway, like DirtyHarry mentioned.... the little things :rolleyes:

[vectraguy01]

well... interesting update. Hopefully not to much longer.
The intake manifold seemed to be all 1 piece from looking at it, so therefore wouldnt suprise me if they had to replace the whole thing.

Good to know that atleast 1 Holden dealership is trying to fix it compared to the other one.

Did they say how long before you get it back??

[Tfer]

well... interesting update. Hopefully not to much longer.
The intake manifold seemed to be all 1 piece from looking at it, so therefore wouldnt suprise me if they had to replace the whole thing.

Good to know that atleast 1 Holden dealership is trying to fix it compared to the other one.

Did they say how long before you get it back??

Yes Chris, I am very happy with their efforts thus far.... and the Veccy, with a little bit of luck, should be in my hands by Monday :D

[Greg K]

good to hear that you are on the home stretch now Tfer....
at least now you have the confidence in a Holden Dealer who is getting your old girl back on the road!

good luck with it all mate!

[Tfer]

good to hear that you are on the home stretch now Tfer....
at least now you have the confidence in a Holden Dealer who is getting your old girl back on the road!

good luck with it all mate!

Thanks Greg K..... its such a good feeling to be the recipient of good service (thus far I might add)..... :)

[vectraguy01]

Yes Chris, I am very happy with their efforts thus far.... and the Veccy, with a little bit of luck, should be in my hands by Monday :D

I'll be over ur way on Monday evening going to the chiro, so give me a call when u have got her back and i might drop around!

[stevedee3]

Leaking/malformed gaskets for the air intake manifoldHmmm, I wonder if this happened when the first dealer removed the intake manifold... anyway it sounds like this dealer has more of a clue about what they're doing - good to hear.

[ope126]

Almost there Thomas, Almost there!:D

[poita]

i think i say it for all
woooooooooooooooooooooooooohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhoooooooo ooooooooooooooo

like others have said its great to know there is a holden dealership out there who knows wat they are doing.
fingers crossed for you mate :)


a trip to bundy should sort things out ;)

[DirtyHarry]

since its thrown an error for the air and coolant temperature, dont you think you should replace those 2 sensors?
hence why your spark plugs were fouling up, the ecu was constantly reading that your car is cold with incorrect air flow, hence pumping too much fuel.

[Tfer]

Hmmm, I wonder if this happened when the first dealer removed the intake manifold... anyway it sounds like this dealer has more of a clue about what they're doing - good to hear.

Yes indeed.... wondering lots at the moment :rolleyes:


Almost there Thomas, Almost there!:D

Ahem to that :D


i think i say it for all
woooooooooooooooooooooooooohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhoooooooo ooooooooooooooo

like others have said its great to know there is a holden dealership out there who knows wat they are doing.
fingers crossed for you mate :)


a trip to bundy should sort things out ;)

Thanks Peter! :D :D :D


since its thrown an error for the air and coolant temperature, dont you think you should replace those 2 sensors?
hence why your spark plugs were fouling up, the ecu was constantly reading that your car is cold with incorrect air flow, hence pumping too much fuel.

You have a point..... :)

UPDATE.......

The Veccy has been in the hands of the head mechanic for the weekend, and used it as his daily driver..... no problems.

Getting a wheel alignment done and she is finished..... now just waiting on the bill and the list of things that have been done. :o

Will post all maybe tonight or tomorrow..... but will be driving the old girl tonight :dance: :dance: :dance:

[Greg K]

happy for ya mate!!!
i bet your itching to take her for a spin!

[vectraguy01]

awesome mate glad its all worked out well.

[Keep'emRunning]

good to hear.. what did this cost you all up to have fixed?

[auzvectra]

no response yet, maybe tom's in hospital with a heartattack from the bill :p.
good to hear, hope it doesnt cost too much for tom, shouldnt i spose, they seemed to be pretty direct to the problem, not much wasted time.
oh and send the bill to the 1st dealer that did the fuel system :D.

[USC]

awesome mate! she now deserves a bit of pampering..:D ..some 1st class wax all over her body!!

[Tfer]

happy for ya mate!!!
i bet your itching to take her for a spin!

And I did.... an easy quick 100kms last night :D


awesome mate glad its all worked out well.

thanks Chris :)


good to hear.. what did this cost you all up to have fixed?

see below ;)


no response yet, maybe tom's in hospital with a heartattack from the bill :p.
good to hear, hope it doesnt cost too much for tom, shouldnt i spose, they seemed to be pretty direct to the problem, not much wasted time.
oh and send the bill to the 1st dealer that did the fuel system :D.

See below.... now to decide on course of action with the other dealer :mad:


awesome mate! she now deserves a bit of pampering..:D ..some 1st class wax all over her body!!

Long detailing session is overdue and very warranted.... agreed :D

FINAL UPDATE (I hope)....

Picked up the Veccy yesterday afternoon. Also got them to do a wheel alignment (mentioned previously) and an engine and engine bay clean down..... needed that.

Main details on cost are as follows:

Total labour: $695
Total parts: $414.88
Total sublet: $125
Total GST: $123.57
Total invoice: $1,359.25Breakdown of parts cost:

Spark plugs: $40.50
Flange: $371.91
Seal ring: $2.47
Total: $414.88Main details on what was found / done:

32 fault codes found and sorted with mainly software upgrades (which hadn't been done since I have had the Veccy)
Main codes that Holden Dealership felt were causing the problems were P0115 (coolant temp sensor circuit range performance), P0110 (intake air temp sensor circuit high output), P0300 (random/multiple cylinder misfire), P0304 (cylinder 4 misifre detected (but other codes were also found for 4 other cylinders, not listed here)), C0460 (steering angle sensor offset range performance traction control light).
Removed intake tube assembly and found seals deformed which were causing a leak.
Replaced spark plugs
Removed injectors (again, but not trusting of previous dealership's efforts) and had them sonic cleaned
Replaced manifold adaptor plate
Reassembled
Clear codes and roadtested for the weekend
No fault codes (must be a first)So, I am happy with the job done. I will admit to being nervous about how she performs over the next period of time.

The positive outcomes with the dealership:

Could correspond with them via email
Daily updates
Fleet service section
They gave me a full tank of fuel
They have basically remained true to their word. They promised and they delivered, and I am very happy with their efforts and service.And..... drum roll please..... the details of the dealership are:

Zupps Mt Gravatt
1310 Logan Road, Mt Gravatt 4122
Telephone: 07 38770000
Contact there is Brian Walker (email: [email protected])But one thing almost set my mind totally at ease.... drove out of the dealership, about 100m down the road, display told me the front right foglight had blew.... yep, the old girl is back! :D

[Wraith]

Happy for you it's all over Thomas.... :)

Bit of whack there with the cost and time it all took, but hey all's well that ends well :)

[stevedee3]

Hooray! :)

[EL BURITO]

well u have your baby back

[poita]

great news thomas, absolutely great news.
so glad u got ur baby back.
they reckon that love is expensive lol

[Vectracious]

But one thing almost set my mind totally at ease.... drove out of the dealership, about 100m down the road, display told me the front right foglight had blew.... yep, the old girl is back! :D


LOL!! Wouldnt be a Vectra with at least 1 blown headlight somewhere or other (used to have at least one out at all times in my B)

Glad she's back mate!

[Tfer]

Happy for you it's all over Thomas.... :)

Bit of whack there with the cost and time it all took, but hey all's well that ends well :)

Very true Ange ;)


Hooray! :)

Yay! :D


well u have your baby back

And I am just like a proud "father" :)


great news thomas, absolutely great news.
so glad u got ur baby back.
they reckon that love is expensive lol

Hellishly so..... but she won't come close to R though :rolleyes:


LOL!! Wouldnt be a Vectra with at least 1 blown headlight somewhere or other (used to have at least one out at all times in my B)

Glad she's back mate!

Thanks Pete..... the blown foggie made me feel so at home again..... :o

And this is why I am not interested in selling the Veccy......

Picked up R and one of her gorgeous female friends from the CBD last night, and the first words from S was....

"Hi Thomas..... god, what sort of car do you have, this is so nice... the leather is awesome"

R rolls her eyes and being a non car person, says quite simply, "its just a car S" and pokes her tongue out at me, in a way that I know she is playing.....

Hmmmm.... the Veccy for the old girl that she is, still impresses the ladies, and you just have to love that :cool:

Thanks for all your support, comments and suggestions.... I will trawel thru the thread to see who was closest, so that I can reward them... stay tuned. :)

[SSS_Hoon]

Congrats on getting her back on the road all patched up and better again, its a good feeling when u get back in and out on the road aint it.


I was wondering if u forgot about the prize hehe, so i should just pm u my addy now should i LoL hehehe:D (what is the prize first?)


Still making a good impression on the ladies hey sweet(unless your married then it sux hehe). so she is into leather hey did u go deeper into her love of leather?


SSS_Hoon

[Tfer]

Congrats on getting her back on the road all patched up and better again, its a good feeling when u get back in and out on the road aint it.


I was wondering if u forgot about the prize hehe, so i should just pm u my addy now should i LoL hehehe:D (what is the prize first?)


Still making a good impression on the ladies hey sweet(unless your married then it sux hehe). so she is into leather hey did u go deeper into her love of leather?


SSS_Hoon

It is wonderful to have her back on the road.... so very different to the AH Astra I have been driving for the past 2+ months.:)

Prize is movie tickets.

As to the leather..... R loves the leather (that's all I need to know) and S is off limits :p :D

[SSS_Hoon]

Yeah i used to hate leather in cars, from my parents old 70's LTD's it was crap, but the newer cars its really good and the heated seats are nice too.

My next car i think i would get the leather for sure.



SSS_Hoon