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View Full Version : Calling MY03 & MY04 Astra owners - Tyres



SmellyTofu
16th January 2004, 05:25 AM
Could you please let me know what placecard is on your car. Also state what kind of car you have (CD, Equipe etc). Also those with HBD wheels too helps (a lot).

Turblue
16th January 2004, 07:22 AM
Sorry, I may be a bit slow..
Placecard ??? HBD ???

ultim8DTM5
16th January 2004, 08:41 AM
Placard is the tyre car which states the factory tyre and wheel dimensions. Determines the maximum legal sizing of wheels and tyres you can go to.

Mine was inside the fuel filler cap if it helps.

SmellyTofu
16th January 2004, 10:37 AM
Thank Ultra... that's the info I am after.. the placard on the inside of the fuel flap. I'm just in a discussion with the RTA (NSW) on the issue of load rating for those that have an Equipe and CD people going up to 205/50R16. This includes people that have gone to HBD wheels.

To be a pedantic idiot, those that have 205/55R16 89V are technically "unroadworthy" coz the tyres are >15mm larger in diameter than the original size. I don't know how Holden got away with it but even that can be the thing that insurance companies can say to stop a payment.

Anonymous
16th January 2004, 12:10 PM
:shock:
GRRRRR.... You leave my HBD Wheels alone...... :twisted:

did u want my details? mine's a 01 city 3 dr with
205/55/16 on HBD's (with the stock Bathurst 1000 tyres they give)

I know that the standard placard has an HBD one stuck over it for the 16inchers.

01CDsedan
16th January 2004, 12:59 PM
>To be a pedantic idiot, those that have 205/55R16 89V are >technically "unroadworthy" coz the tyres are >15mm larger in diameter >than the original size.

Doesn't this mean that everyone with the HBD wheels would have an inaccurate speedo because the rolling diameter is greater?

SmellyTofu
16th January 2004, 01:17 PM
>To be a pedantic idiot, those that have 205/55R16 89V are >technically "unroadworthy" coz the tyres are >15mm larger in diameter >than the original size.

Doesn't this mean that everyone with the HBD wheels would have an inaccurate speedo because the rolling diameter is greater?

Yes, that's right and not only that (to keep on prodding Samvac more) is that the 55 profile is 16.xmm taller in diameter.. so watch out! the insurance companies has been notified! :D

I think the only feasible option is to go 17" in 205/45R17 88W (some tread have this weight rating) but considering how smooth Sydney roads are, you'll realise why some people like the good ol' Grand Rally S.

Anonymous
16th January 2004, 01:37 PM
>so watch out! the insurance companies has been notified!
Big Mouth :cry:

Okay mr Smarty Pants. :o

Hypothetical time
If I were to prang my car at my fault (and my car was stock, the way the dealer gave it to me with hbd wheels on).... and my insurance found that those wheels were the fault.

Can i claim against holden because they provided it as a genuine part....

Not that i'm that worried anyway, that just adds to the list of uninsured things.

Dregger will fix everything.... i hope.... :?

SmellyTofu
16th January 2004, 01:50 PM
I just think Holden stuffed up big time with the compliance of the Astra and tried to patch it up now (which still doesn't help its cause). I think you could go sue Holden for it... I think I could too with my SRi wheels. I'm too buggered to stuff around with it and since the 16" is almost worn out in another 5,000km or so, I'm going back to the good ol' 15" DL SP2020E.

Anyone feel like calling up the 1800 number for Holden Customer service and work out what tyres were used to comply the CD and Equipe. Well, that's what the dealer has told me.

Btw, Samvac, your car is fine coz it's a City.. it came with 86 rated tyres so it's a non-issue for you. It's only those people with 195/60R15 88H as their stock rubber that this concerns.

Jass
16th January 2004, 02:03 PM
Iam thinking of putting 18x 7.5 chrome rims on my SRi Turbo with 35 profile tyres, but iam a bit worried if they might scrape. Anyone changed rims on there car yet?

SmellyTofu
16th January 2004, 02:10 PM
Get the offsets right and you'll be right.

Jass
16th January 2004, 02:14 PM
Yeah iam going to go see the guys at Tempe tyres as they seem to know there stuff. Last thing i want is scraping on the back wheels, specially since iam putting in 12 inch subs in the boot this weekend.

SmellyTofu
16th January 2004, 02:52 PM
I have no respect for Tempe tyres... except cheap prices.... just don't let them fit the tyres.

Rhino
16th January 2004, 03:01 PM
Iam thinking of putting 18x 7.5 chrome rims on my SRi Turbo with 35 profile tyres, but iam a bit worried if they might scrape. Anyone changed rims on there car yet?

35s :shock:

Hard as a rock! Better put a cushion (leather of course) on the drivers seat :)

SmellyTofu
16th January 2004, 03:05 PM
Btw, can anyone answer the original question pls! :)

SmellyTofu
16th January 2004, 03:51 PM
OK.. report in summary

Talked to the RTA and they basically said, follow the ADR.

Called up Customer service in Melb... they understand the issue but don't have a solution.. go call up HBD in Adelaide.

Call up HBD, and they don't have an answer and if they were to refer it to the engineer that they'd say that whoever has given the information about the load index is wrong and that their product meets the standard.

But I am still in limbo in some legal mumbo jumbo at the end of the day.

astranomical
17th January 2004, 08:40 PM
hey there~!

I was stuck with the same problem when i was trying to fit 16" convertible alloys to my CD sedan. So I was a bit hesitant on fitting 87Vs on them, but finally ended up fitting Yokohama S306 205/50/16 with a load rating of 91V. As far as I can tell they are the right size and also the right load rating so would hopefully keep the insurance people happy! Only down side is that the grip on these things aint to exactly crash hot....but better to be safe then sorry.

And your rite....holden are no help on the matter, best advice they offered me was to order another placard from the CDX models which never eventuated now about 6 months later. And even if i did get it, they said changing it was at my own risk and they were not gonna be responsible for any future problems.

SmellyTofu
17th January 2004, 10:57 PM
Yeah.. S306.. not exactly world turning rubber... and I refuse to use Silverstone FTZ in 215/50R16 90V... I might as well run Grand Rally S than that shit.

How much was the S306 anyway?

Btw, I have already changed the placard on the car... not that it makes it legal....

imay
18th January 2004, 10:28 AM
Sorry it's taken a while to get my information to you Smelly.
I'm driving a 2002 build MY03 CD 5 door; tyre placard states 195/60 R15 88H, which is what is on the car at present.
I'll be following this conversation with interest. Sounds like Holden's/Opel may have pulled another clanger! Hope no one here suffers because of it.
Ian.

astranomical
18th January 2004, 11:26 AM
Yeah....choices are pretty limited but whan can ya do when u have a stuffed up load rating? But if i recall correctly, I think i got mine fitted and blanced for about 170 each at bob janes and then like 30 bucks more for nitro.

Just happy that insurance wont be up my ass in the event that i have a crash :D

SmellyTofu
18th January 2004, 01:56 PM
imay, I don't think it's to do with Opel, but more so the ADR rulings. But how does Ford do it on their Focus? They run 195/60R15 88H on their CL and Ghia models yet have an option for 215/45R17 87V.

rjastra
19th January 2004, 08:51 AM
I am not sure what the issue is here?

Is it the fact that the City/CD has a placard that recommends a 205/55 x 16 with a load index > 90?

If so, i think you will find that ALL the tyres from Michelin that match that size have a load rating that matches or exceeds that. That even includes a version of the new Preceda.

SmellyTofu
19th January 2004, 12:56 PM
Rj, it's coz the fact that the original Equipe/CD has a placard that says tyres must have a weight index of 88 or higher. Something that is not achieveable with 205/50R16 nor 205/45R17 nor 215/45R17 (some tyres). 205/55R16 89V is larger than 195/60R15 by 16.x mm which is also "legally" not allowed under the RTA rules. The only option I see is 215/50R16 90V but is a very rare size in Australia (but plentiful elsewhere in the world).

The issue also is how Holden managed to get away with this technicality which I'd like to know so I can do the same thing so that I can continue to run 205/50R16

NUTTTR
20th January 2004, 12:59 AM
Ah, so after reading this is the SRi affected at all? It comes with 205/50/16's..... have to check them tomorrow to see the load index.... after 11,000k's my fronts are half well done, they are pirelli P6000's, but they aren't that good :)
Aaron

[edit - according to pirelli website, in aust, only comes in 87W
!]

SmellyTofu
20th January 2004, 05:44 AM
No. It's only for any Astra that has 195/60R15 fitted as standard.

Btw, the turbo rubber may give owners difficulty finding another suitable tyre coz of the 87 rating. 205/45R17 is normally an 83 rating. The stock rubber is an extra load tyre. I presume 215/45R17 87V (some 91) will be the popular choice if you don't intend to buy the standard Dunlop SP8000

rjastra
21st January 2004, 03:03 PM
Not quite true Smelly.

At least Pirelli and Michelin make tyres of the correct size and load index for the Astra Turbo

SmellyTofu
21st January 2004, 03:41 PM
Extra load tyres are not popular in Australia. There is a 205/50R16 in 91V that Toyo makes but they are not importing such a tyre from the US.

craig.j
22nd January 2004, 06:53 AM
Rj, it's coz the fact that the original Equipe/CD has a placard that says tyres must have a weight index of 88 or higher. Something that is not achieveable with 205/50R16 nor 205/45R17 nor 215/45R17 (some tyres). 205/55R16 89V is larger than 195/60R15 by 16.x mm which is also "legally" not allowed under the RTA rules. The only option I see is 215/50R16 90V but is a very rare size in Australia (but plentiful elsewhere in the world).

The issue also is how Holden managed to get away with this technicality which I'd like to know so I can do the same thing so that I can continue to run 205/50R16



I have a new Astra SXi (it's the model below the SRi). It came with 205/50 R16 87V Continental Sports, and it's fine - chews the rubber a little bit, but never mind!!


http://vauxhall.co.uk/repositories/images/VehicleLargeColour/Astra/sxi3dr_black-sapphire_2003.jpg?

euro_stylin
23rd January 2004, 08:25 AM
ok im confussed...i put 205x55 on my astra! so does this mean that my speedo is out? and if yes, am i going faster or slower than what my speedo says and by how much?
also if i ever have to put the spare tyre on which is just the standard 195x60 will it make a difference when i drive it? and stuff my car?

SmellyTofu
23rd January 2004, 09:10 AM
Yes, your speedo will be reading almost 3% out. You're actually driving at 103 when the speedo says 100.

If you put the stocks back on the front wheels, your steering will be tracking straight but the steering wheel aimed at the opposite side to where your spare tyres is on to compensate for the variation in height.

Craig, our SXi came with 195/60R15 and it is also affected in this stupid legal issue.

astrix
23rd January 2004, 11:41 AM
euro-stylin
If you run a piece of string around the circumference of a tyre on your car and measure this, then do the same with your spare(orignal), subtract the second figure from the first figure, divide this by the circumferance of spare(original) and multiply by 100 this will give you the percentage difference that your speedo is out.
You can give these figures to your Holden dealer next time your in for service and they can adjust the speedo as long as the difference is 5% or less.
Haven't actually done this myself yet but I asked the dealer about this when I changed wheels and that is what I was told.
My speedo is reading about 2% high due to the larger wheel circumference and I'm going to get it adjusted next month when the car is serviced.
2% is not very much but it might mean the difference between getting a ticket or not as a lot of people tend to drive slightly over the speed limit anyway, I know Ido.

Dregger
29th January 2004, 07:19 PM
>
Hypothetical time
If I were to prang my car at my fault (and my car was stock, the way the dealer gave it to me with hbd wheels on).... and my insurance found that those wheels were the fault.

Can i claim against holden because they provided it as a genuine part....

Not that i'm that worried anyway, that just adds to the list of uninsured things.

Dregger will fix everything.... i hope.... :?


the answer is NO.....sorry u can't claim against holden....it doesn't work like that.

SmellyTofu
29th January 2004, 10:54 PM
And most probably not covered at all by insurance. If you don't declare your mods, then there is a chance that if anything should happen *touchwood for everyone*, then the insurance companies can refuse your claim in total.

Oh, back to the topic, I moved back to stock 15" coz there isn't any 16" rubber cheap enough. No more issue for me (for now). :D

chenga
16th February 2004, 05:32 PM
smelly,

funny u are, or were, still troubled by this very problem, which must have been more than 2 years now!

r u telling me u gave up on ur SRi alloys???
i've been trying really hard to destroy my Goodyear Ventura crap so that i can move to more decent tyres, now that i'm ready to make the move u just shattered my dream.... :(

BTW i traded in my original 15" coz i've no place to store them, so moving back ot 15" is not as straight forward as was ur case...aaiiii...

chenga

SmellyTofu
16th February 2004, 05:39 PM
Hey Chenga! Welcome welcome!

Well, not really given up on the 16" but coz of the cost + new co. car, I didn't bother with spending $600+ for a whole set of 16" rubber for a car I won't drive much.

Anyway, Holden doesn't seem to want to know about it and deny there is a problem... *shrug*

daastra
19th February 2004, 09:01 AM
Ok guys, I've read over this, procrastinated, read over it, procrastinated and guess what... I'm still confused!!!! :roll:

I've got a 3 door 2001 Astra (as you all know) and on him I have 205/45R16 83W. Is this roadworthy???

I don't wanna get pulled over bythe jacks and get all smart with them and watch whack a canary on my car in return. :wink:

ANSWERS PLEASE!!!

Anonymous
19th February 2004, 09:05 AM
Im still confused as well....
but my tyres are stock from HBD and smelly reassured me that i'm fine.... but don't know about ur tyres tho :?

but semi OT: what do u think about the 45 profile on ur 16's? i was thinking of putting 45's on, but i didn't want to make the wheels look small....

ultim8DTM5
19th February 2004, 10:23 AM
Yes, your speedo will be reading almost 3% out. You're actually driving at 103 when the speedo says 100.

If you put the stocks back on the front wheels, your steering will be tracking straight but the steering wheel aimed at the opposite side to where your spare tyres is on to compensate for the variation in height.

Craig, our SXi came with 195/60R15 and it is also affected in this stupid legal issue.

Speedo's are normally over when they are brand new. For example, with my Barina, indicated speed was 100kmh but actual speed was 95kmh (Correvit)

Usually they are overcalibrated from the factory so that they give a more consistant reading over time when everything settles, including tyre wear.

SmellyTofu
19th February 2004, 10:37 AM
Ok guys, I've read over this, procrastinated, read over it, procrastinated and guess what... I'm still confused!!!! :roll:

I've got a 3 door 2001 Astra (as you all know) and on him I have 205/45R16 83W. Is this roadworthy???

I don't wanna get pulled over bythe jacks and get all smart with them and watch whack a canary on my car in return. :wink:

ANSWERS PLEASE!!!

Technically no coz your weight index of the tyres are way under the minimum 86 (for a City), 88 (for a CD and Equipe model) and 87 for the rest. You'll hear tyre places say, "nah, that's OK mate" ... when in fact, insurance can refuse claim on that if they were that anal.

ultim8DTM5
19th February 2004, 10:40 AM
>
Hypothetical time
If I were to prang my car at my fault (and my car was stock, the way the dealer gave it to me with hbd wheels on).... and my insurance found that those wheels were the fault.

Can i claim against holden because they provided it as a genuine part....

Not that i'm that worried anyway, that just adds to the list of uninsured things.

Dregger will fix everything.... i hope.... :?


the answer is NO.....sorry u can't claim against holden....it doesn't work like that.

I'd like to see what the Motor Dealers Act says about that! Especially the bit about selling cars which are unroadworthy and illegal...

SmellyTofu
19th February 2004, 10:47 AM
I've seen cars with 205/45R16 on .. and brand spankers too. None of the dealers gave a shXt about it...

Anonymous
19th February 2004, 10:55 AM
45's r definately a no go for me.... legally that is??? i think the rims look small enough as it is.... 45's would make them look tiny

ultim8DTM5
19th February 2004, 10:56 AM
I will most likely run 45s when I put the 16s on, Kumho Ecstas as I can get a good deal on them.

All in time, too much of my Savings is already accounted for!

SmellyTofu
19th February 2004, 10:59 AM
Scott, go 205/50R16. You're very legal there on that size.

ultim8DTM5
19th February 2004, 11:21 AM
Whats a good width for 16x6? 195?

SmellyTofu
19th February 2004, 11:54 AM
Yeah.. 6" is about 195... though u can run 205 without too much problems of sidewall flex.

ultim8DTM5
19th February 2004, 12:01 PM
Yeah cuz 205s are more for 6.5in widths, I guess I'll give it more thought when the time comes to put the money down

slyone
20th February 2004, 09:21 AM
I have no respect for Tempe tyres... except cheap prices.... just don't let them fit the tyres.

Smelly Whats the story with Tempe tyres? I am looking at getting a set of rims and one of my options are them.

SmellyTofu
20th February 2004, 09:34 AM
Nothing much apart from stories about scratched rims by part timers working there (esp on weekends).. Also (though probably a myth or real) that they take down your address etc and they go steal them back.... dunno how true it is... but u got to wonder...

Ditto Australia's best (but never the stealing bit). Just maybe point out that it's not scratched now and don't expect them to be scratched when u put new rubbers on them.

ultim8DTM5
20th February 2004, 10:27 AM
Tempe used to sell a fair lot of Falkens without DOT stamps on them.
I'll let you figure out the rest...

SmellyTofu
20th February 2004, 11:40 AM
But does that really matter? there isn't really a "standard" apparent for tyres in this country even though it's a parallel import.

Anonymous
20th February 2004, 06:47 PM
Also on tyre fitters...ask them to hand tighten the wheel nuts. on my old city i had to have the discs machined twice cause they overtightened the nuts using rattleguns!

ultim8DTM5
21st February 2004, 07:39 AM
But does that really matter? there isn't really a "standard" apparent for tyres in this country even though it's a parallel import.

Its in the ADRs I believe?
All I know is when you import a car with brand new S03s from Japan, guess what, you've got to get some 60 profile cheap steel bands from Bob Jane so you can pass compliance

SmellyTofu
21st February 2004, 07:51 AM
I heard about that. You get the grey imports which have really good Japanese rubber on them and then the compliers have to "chuck" them out and whack on some Silverstone FTZ and ruin the whole lot.

Dregger
23rd February 2004, 06:02 PM
basically insurance have their own standards...as long as u copnform to them, then they must pay. for example. if your car had blue and red lights in teh window.....u were driving down the street with them on. cop sees you, u get canairy.


if u take ur car to insurance assessor after a prang, he wont give a shit abotu the light, if you come driving into the workshop with em flashing.


its a bit hard to explain......the complexitites....

ultim8DTM5
23rd February 2004, 08:15 PM
The only people who have standards are the large insurance companies such as NRMA, AAMI et al.

Insurance has nothing to do with legalities or rules of the road. You pay the $$$$ you can get anything and everything insured. Insurance companies only make up these rules and "legalities" so they can put it on contract and void your claim should you break this contract by not complying to it.

Remember, they are out to make money, not give it out.

chenga
24th February 2004, 02:42 AM
actually u would think big insurance comp, esp. NRMA, would not be that anal to refute ur claim on small technicality.

my uni friend had the same +1 fitment problem as discussed above, he had an at-fault accident on his Accord (or was it a Camry?) last yr which cost $15000 to fix (must have been close to the write-off figure :? )

that was approved by NRMA without problem, anyone had trouble claiming against NRMA be4?

ultim8DTM5
24th February 2004, 10:11 AM
I guess its up to the assessor. I knew a guy with an E30 BMW who had 17s on and got his claim rejected. Serves him right though, he never told them about it anyway...it was NRMA btw.

Did the Accord have +1 or greater than?

chenga
24th February 2004, 01:17 PM
it was an accord or some other mid-size "accountant" car...ie Camry,Avalon,Maxima....i can't recall...

he said it was +1 fitment only and he did told NRMA abt having "non-standard alloys". he said the new tyres have a lower weight loading index than specified on the placard.

from my understanding, with NRMA, the key is NEVER get wider alloys than they would allow. i.e. for an non-SRi astra they wouldn't allow anything wider than 6.5" (most 16" alloys are 7") which is one of the reason why i'd gone for the SRi 6" alloys.

obviously u expect trouble when u crash ur Civic or Accord with 18" alloys on them :roll:

selby
24th March 2004, 09:38 PM
I'm driving a nov 2001 Astra SRi
Tyres: Michelin 205/50 R 16 87V

Selby

Anonymous
4th April 2004, 01:44 PM
Hey there,

There will be two more 87Y load rated tyres being released in
aus this year according to the reps, I think the Dunlops are the worst high performance tyre I have driven on and do the car no justice. Wait for the new Michelin pilot sports to arrive. We have test fitted new BBS challenge wheels to my Turbo in 18x8.5 and as has been said i is all about the offset. I work in the wheel industry so if you`ve got any questions give me a yell

Cheers