Turbo vs. VXR Weight [Archive]

xplosv57

6th August 2007, 04:56 PM

Just flicking through the back of the latest Motor mag (wishing i could afford 1/2 the cars in here) and noticed the Astra Turbo is 8kg heavier (1401kg) than the VXR (1393kg)!!

You would think with the bigger brakes/wheels/bodykit that the VXR would be a bit porkier!!!

Anyone shed some light on this?? :confused:

LOL i know its only 8kg but its just a good discussion point!!! :D

GreyRex

6th August 2007, 05:03 PM

SRi-T has a steel spare wheel. What does the VXR have?

xplosv57

6th August 2007, 05:04 PM

SRi-T has a steel spare wheel. What does the VXR have?

Ahh good point Ben, makes sense if the VXR has a spave saver or something!!!! Theres the weight diff!!!!

bornwild

6th August 2007, 05:07 PM

Good observation. Weird thing that, isn't it?

I'm guessing it's due to the VXR having the lighter, Recaro, seats and it has the space saver spare wheel. And the VXR has sports brakes, hence saving some kg there as well.

bornwild

6th August 2007, 05:12 PM

SRi-T has a steel spare wheel. What does the VXR have?

It doesn't come with the full 18"??

xplosv57

6th August 2007, 05:14 PM

Good observation. Weird thing that, isn't it?

I'm guessing it's due to the VXR having the lighter, Recaro, seats and it has the space saver spare wheel [s]whereas the turbo has the full 18"[\s]. And the VXR has sports brakes, hence saving some kg there as well.

LOL i had too much time on my hands today!!!

Well the space saver makes sense, maybe owners can shed some light on this, the bigger brakes on the VXR would also be heavier too, not by much, but still heavier!!!

Maybe the Recaros are lighter than the standard leather items in the Turbo!!!

RudeOne

6th August 2007, 05:16 PM

The vxr doesn't really have a "space saver", its a 17inch alloy with a 205 tyre on it, you cant fit that phat 19 in the boot :)

I know its technically a spacesaver, but the weight difference between that and the 18inch turbo alloy isn't going to be 8kg

I wonder whether the body kit is made from a lighter weight material??

or Motor mag is wrong, as they have been over and over again :)

one way to check. redbook:

VXR:
http://www.redbookasiapacific.com/au/vehicle/specs.php?key=HSV+07AO&new=1

kerb:1393kg

SRIT:
http://www.redbookasiapacific.com/au/vehicle/specs.php?key=HOLD07HU&new=1

Kerb: 1401

wow, im impressed, motor have been able to replicate some data without making an error.!!

RudeOne

6th August 2007, 05:21 PM

If anything i think recaros will be heavier, they are huge compared with the turb's.

It might be,

body kit
alloys - lighter material

a long shot would be that lighter materials are used in: (but i doubt it?)

engine
brakes
suspension

i don't know

These questions are starting to highlight that the vxr isn't just a kitted up and tuned SRiT, it is becoming more apparent that their are some major engineering differences.

GreyRex

6th August 2007, 05:21 PM

Good observation. Weird thing that, isn't it?

I'm guessing it's due to the VXR having the lighter, Recaro, seats and it has the space saver spare wheel [s]whereas the turbo has the full 18"[\s]. And the VXR has sports brakes, hence saving some kg there as well.

The Turbo only has 16" a steel spare i think... believe me, that's all that'll fit in there!! Well that's all ive got in mine!! The VXR has 19's... (big mothas), bigger brakes... i would've thought all together it should be heavier

bornwild

6th August 2007, 05:26 PM

These questions are starting to highlight that the vxr isn't just a kitted up and tuned SRiT, it is becoming more apparent that their are some major engineering differences.

Who said it's just a kitted up turbo?

bornwild

6th August 2007, 05:28 PM

LOL i had too much time on my hands today!!!

Well the space saver makes sense, maybe owners can shed some light on this, the bigger brakes on the VXR would also be heavier too, not by much, but still heavier!!!

Maybe the Recaros are lighter than the standard leather items in the Turbo!!!

Nah I doubt the brakes would be heavier, they'd be quite noticeably lighter. They're performance brakes, no way can they be heavier; being bigger has nothing to do with weight.

RudeOne

6th August 2007, 05:31 PM

Who said it's just a kitted up turbo?

no-one specific, its just been thrown around in another thread and even in my own mind, i always wondered what are the real differences, not a stab or anything, just a general comment, open for discussion.

bornwild

6th August 2007, 05:34 PM

Saying "kitted-up" is taking the VXR for granted. Though chassis-wise there is no real differences between them.

xplosv57

6th August 2007, 05:35 PM

Yes but in being bigger, they would be heavier!!

They haven't used different materials in making performance brakes, all they have done is used a bigger diameter disc and a bigger pad so there is a larger contact surface which would slow the car down faster!!! (if that makes sense??)

But yeah does show there are many differences between the Turbo and VXR, you'd hope so with the extra 10k or so price tag!!!

bornwild

6th August 2007, 05:42 PM

Yes but that would also mean that they're carrying more inertia which would partially cancel the point of having bigger brakes.....

xplosv57

6th August 2007, 05:45 PM

I dunno, but i fit brakes at work, and the bigger discs/pads are always heavier (especially 4wd's, bloody heavy bastards!!)

bornwild

6th August 2007, 05:49 PM

Does the VXR have a 6cd stacker?

GreyRex

6th August 2007, 05:49 PM

I dunno, but i fit brakes at work, and the bigger discs/pads are always heavier (especially 4wd's, bloody heavy bastards!!)

I would have thought along the same lines. But anyway, what a topic!! I've never seen people respond so quickly!!

blueraven

6th August 2007, 05:56 PM

Guys, there is no argument.

The VXR has a different engine, different gearbox, different suspension, different bodykit, different interior, different wheels, different tyres, different exhaust, different intercooler setup etc etc etc....

Its only a coincedence that they are close in weight, the Vxr probably has alot of different parts that weight more and less, just happens to almost balance out.

RudeOne

6th August 2007, 05:57 PM

Does the VXR have a 6cd stacker?

yes!

i hope you don't think there is a 8kg difference between the cd 30 and cdc40 :D :D

bornwild

6th August 2007, 05:59 PM

There would be at least 1-2kg :D

xplosv57

6th August 2007, 06:01 PM

I would have thought along the same lines. But anyway, what a topic!! I've never seen people respond so quickly!!

LOL same, i opened up a can of worms didn't i!!!! I need more days off so i can do more of this haha!!!! :D

xplosv57

6th August 2007, 06:04 PM

Guys, there is no argument.

LOL but wheres the fun in that???? :p

GreyRex

6th August 2007, 06:05 PM

LOL same, i opened up a can of worms didn't i!!!! I need more days off so i can do more of this haha!!!! :D

Next topic... fuel economy between Turbo and VXR

Next topic... Seat comparison between Turbo and VXR

NEXT lol!!

OPC

6th August 2007, 06:25 PM

8kg aint much anyway...

xplosv57

6th August 2007, 06:29 PM

Well i guess its a plus for the VXR, for the extra $10k you get a more powerful AND lighter car than the SRi-T!!!!!

MatsHolden

6th August 2007, 06:54 PM

The VXR doesn't have the CDC suspension system that the SRi-T does.. possibly another avenue for added weight.

aussie_in_london

6th August 2007, 09:02 PM

In the UK the cdc system fitted to the European spec astra became an option following extensive testing it was found to be to harsh a ride and not set up right for typically bad British roads, so inturn Vxl called in Gavin Kershaw from Lotus who spent approx 15 weeks setting up the Astra VXR but they had to make compromises for the driving miss daisy owners through to the enthusiates who most end up fitting uprated and lowered springs to the Lotus dampers.
The passive chassis (non cdc) is a Lotus set up and differs vastly from the regular SRi sports chassis.
Now is the VXR chassis more aggressive than the SRi? It is in every area. Chassis is 15mm lower , front anti roll bar bigger , rebound springs added to front dampers to control roll , new front uprights and steering knuckle raised roll centre up by 30mm, spring and damper rates increased by 40 and 50%, rear axle is unique to VXR and effectively invokes oversteer, net result is the car steers and pivots ‘sky hook’ style, is more composed over bumps and delivers a more direct steering feel.
Technically apart from the pick up points for the suspension being the same everything else is different.
Does that make the SRi chassie bad? no not at all, just not as aggressive as what you find on the VXR.
HTH

USC

6th August 2007, 09:35 PM

interesting...I cant feel any difference in an sri-t when the sports button is activated apart from better throttle response....what is its purpose??

Wraith

6th August 2007, 11:04 PM

Yes but that would also mean that they're carrying more inertia which would partially cancel the point of having bigger brakes.....

Bigger brakes or more to the point, larger dia. discs work better by providing a longer lever arm effect, think of leverage, the longer the lever, the greater the moment of force produced at the opposite end of the force being applied to it.

So the further out you go from the hub centre of a wheel and apply any given force the greater it's effect back in the centre of the hub, so the larger diameter disk will provide greater stopping power even with the same given calliper pressure applied.

They will weigh more and once turning do have more inertia, that's why larger area pads are introduced and because of force dissipation over larger surface areas, the larger callipers have more pistons as well, for greater surface contact pressure.

Anyways, I think this weight thing is due to the different suspension set ups as Aussie has pointed out, but I also believe that the VXR's weight is with the standard 18" wheels fitted and not the 19's.

Only one way to be sure, grab an example of each and get them down to a weigh bridge or somewhere else where they can be weighed up :)

AF1R

6th August 2007, 11:29 PM

Heated seats?? Does the SRIT come with heated seats like in the G? Obviously it wouldnt make a total difference of 8Kg but it would contribute to it.

USC

7th August 2007, 09:37 AM

Heated seats?? Does the SRIT come with heated seats like in the G? Obviously it wouldnt make a total difference of 8Kg but it would contribute to it.

yes it does...love them in winter :)

bornwild

7th August 2007, 09:59 AM

Bigger brakes or more to the point, larger dia. discs work better by providing a longer lever arm effect, think of leverage, the longer the lever, the greater the moment of force produced at the opposite end of the force being applied to it.

So the further out you go from the hub centre of a wheel and apply any given force the greater it's effect back in the centre of the hub, so the larger diameter disk will provide greater stopping power even with the same given calliper pressure applied.

They will weigh more and once turning do have more inertia, that's why larger area pads are introduced and because of force dissipation over larger surface areas, the larger callipers have more pistons as well, for greater surface contact pressure.

Anyways, I think this weight thing is due to the different suspension set ups as Aussie has pointed out, but I also believe that the VXR's weight is with the standard 18" wheels fitted and not the 19's.

Only one way to be sure, grab an example of each and get them down to a weigh bridge or somewhere else where they can be weighed up :)

I know wraith...I study Mech. Eng. :p

I know racing brakes are heaps lighter, so I thought they'd be at least a couple of hundred grams lighter in the VXR....but yeah obviously they didn't spend as much money on the VXR as I thought they had :)

bornwild

7th August 2007, 10:04 AM

yes it does...love them in winter :)

I have them too....LOVE THEM TO DEATH :D

MatsHolden

7th August 2007, 08:34 PM

interesting...I cant feel any difference in an sri-t when the sports button is activated apart from better throttle response....what is its purpose??

It stiffens up the shocks and quickens the steering rack (you don't need to turn the wheel as much). Very noticeable.

JohnBu

9th August 2007, 01:19 PM

I know wraith...I study Mech. Eng. :p

I know racing brakes are heaps lighter, so I thought they'd be at least a couple of hundred grams lighter in the VXR....but yeah obviously they didn't spend as much money on the VXR as I thought they had :)

don't forget, they aren't a full racing brakes.

for a road car larger heavier disc are effective. while heavier is not ideal for unsprung weight, the benefits of having larger disc- VXR outweighs (pardon the pun) the benefits of having smaller lighter disc- SRi Turbo.