Rant - 'Point-to-point' speed cameras are now on [Vic]

[pred8r]

Id like to thank those responsible for effectively reducing our speedlimits on those freeways by 10km/h, as now the majority of people will watch their speedo not their surroundings.

For the uninitiated what does this mean?
eg. you are driving at 100km/h, there is a truck/erratic driver/other if front of you causing a potential hazard waiting to happen. You pass this vehicle, by exceeding the 100km/h limit for a few hundred meters.You return to your initial 100km/h travelling speed. You go under a second speed point and BINGO!! your average speed exceeded 103km/h and just got fined for the privilege of passing an idiot.

If you are a courier/delivery driver it can add ½hr to your day. You sit at 10km/h slower and do 400km/day. @100km/h you will spend 4 hrs in the driving seat. At 90km/h (due to the above said reasons) in the same 4 hours you will have only done 360km. 40km more (6min40sec/10km@90km/h) makes it approximately 25mins longer to do the same distance. Your 8hr day is now 8.5, so dont forget to thank the appropriate people for the introduction of our new revenue machines.

Also an observation, considering my time spent on our freeway system, I feel the majority of freeway accidents on these roads are at less than the posted speed. During peak hours you have virtually no chance at reaching the speed limit and in most cases are doing an average of 20km/h less than whats posted.
From most of what Ive seen, the results of accidents, the causes appear to be either low speed/distraction or lack of awareness of their surroundings; people run up the back of others due to the front vehicle outbraking them (probably the most common), people clipping trucks/other vehicles,
people swerving out of the way and into others.
Rarely is there a 400m long set of skidmarks and gouges in the road ending in a pair of taillights protruding from a cement bridge pylon, if there is, its a fresh one from the previous night In which case the speedlimit would have been irrelevant anyway.

DONT even get me started on;
a/ The 3 strand motorcycle rider slice and dice that sits beside our freeways.
b/ The trafficlights at freeway entrances (they change green-red in about a second, my van does 0-100 in 17sec. I cant even cross the F**KING things without running a red or should i sit there all night?)

Oooh, feels better now I got that out.
Drive safely and be careful its a finefield out there;).

[Calibrated]

Australia has to have one of the WORST set of road laws in the world.

For a country that has so many high performance vehicles on the road, they will never see more than half way up their speedo..

As bad as South Africa is proclaimed to be, i must say, we have alot more intelligence when it comes to making laws..

[auzvectra]

As bad as South Africa is proclaimed to be, i must say, we have alot more intelligence when it comes to making laws..

haha love it, i would so belive that :D

[dustbug]

Australia has to have one of the WORST set of road laws in the world.

For a country that has so many high performance vehicles on the road, they will never see more than half way up their speedo..

As bad as South Africa is proclaimed to be, i must say, we have alot more intelligence when it comes to making laws..

From what i know, in south africa you do not have a demit point system. So if you are caught speeding you just have to pay a fine.

Is this correct?

[Calibrated]

From what i know, in south africa you do not have a demit point system. So if you are caught speeding you just have to pay a fine.

Is this correct?
correct, but also on a tiered structure, and if you are above 60kmh over the limit its immediate license loss and a nice cell with bubba. and car impounded.

[Calibrated]

haha love it, i would so belive that :D

i never said how well the law's are enforced:p

[platypus]

For the uninitiated what does this mean?
eg. you are driving at 100km/h, there is a truck/erratic driver/other if front of you causing a potential hazard waiting to happen. You pass this vehicle, by exceeding the 100km/h limit for a few hundred meters.You return to your initial 100km/h travelling speed. You go under a second speed point and BINGO!! your average speed exceeded 103km/h and just got fined for the privilege of passing an idiot.

while i AGREE with you, i might point out that the law gives no exemption for overtaking, avoiding problems, etc... speeding is speeding, if you have to exceed the speed limit to over take then you don't need to overtake (in the eyes of the law).....


grr makes my blood boil, and i'm sure everyone else who has ever been on the wrong side of the road overtaking!!


and point to point has been on trial for a while now in the Woloongong/Illawarra region of NSW

[Calibrated]

while i AGREE with you, i might point out that the law gives no exemption for overtaking, avoiding problems, etc... speeding is speeding, if you have to exceed the speed limit to over take then you don't need to overtake (in the eyes of the law).....


grr makes my blood boil, and i'm sure everyone else who has ever been on the wrong side of the road overtaking!!


and point to point has been on trial for a while now in the Woloongong/Illawarra region of NSW

on the other hand ,if you feel like some fun..

go past camera 1 at a slow speed...pull over, have a break, have a kit kat...

and then fly past camera 2 at flying speeds (not that i condone speeding) but just to see the look on peoples faces...lol:eek:

[platypus]

on the other hand ,if you feel like some fun..

go past camera 1 at a slow speed...pull over, have a break, have a kit kat...

and then fly past camera 2 at flying speeds (not that i condone speeding) but just to see the look on peoples faces...lol:eek:
did that on the Illawara ones - is good fun!!

[pred8r]

while i AGREE with you, i might point out that the law gives no exemption for overtaking, avoiding problems, etc... speeding is speeding, if you have to exceed the speed limit to over take then you don't need to overtake (in the eyes of the law).....

Absolutely - the maximum speed you can do is what is posted. If you pass someone who is doing 98km/h in a 100 zone you will be there for a LOOOONG time (possibly in danger, esp. when not on a dual carriageway)

Camera's dont care, at least with Mr Officer you MAY get some sympathy/leniency.

[MatsHolden]

while i AGREE with you, i might point out that the law gives no exemption for overtaking, avoiding problems, etc... speeding is speeding, if you have to exceed the speed limit to over take then you don't need to overtake (in the eyes of the law).....




Unless smart policing with disretion is put into place which isn't possible with point to point cameras. For instance when overtaking a slower car I'll give it a burst up to about 120 to spend less time on the wrong side of the road... I had an instance once where I was passing quite a few slower vehicles over about 30mins or so and had a XR6 Falcon following me through, then when the XR6 decided to overtake me it turned out ot be an unmarked police car. That is how it should be policed. He saw that I was only going up to 120ish to pass and then straight back down to the 100 limit. Putting it into the hands of machines means any 'discretion' goes out the window. Rediculous.

[AF1R]

so where are these cameras? Hopefully not on the Western Ring Road

[MatsHolden]

Absolutely - the maximum speed you can do is what is posted. If you pass someone who is doing 98km/h in a 100 zone you will be there for a LOOOONG time (possibly in danger, esp. when not on a dual carriageway)

Camera's dont care, at least with Mr Officer you MAY get some sympathy/leniency.

lol pretty much somes up what I was saying but in many fewer words! :D

[MatsHolden]

so where are these cameras? Hopefully not on the Western Ring Road

10 sites along the Hume Fwy...

[pred8r]

so where are these cameras? Hopefully not on the Western Ring Road
Yes, where and their FACING

From brooklyn to greensborough;
Between westgate freeway and twin shells (behind sign) GOING
After EJ Whitten bridge, keilor park drive extension bridge GOING
Pascoe Vale Rd bridge COMING

Greensborough to Westgate;
Footbridge before Pascoe Vale Rd GOING
Crossover bridge near Keilor/Calder turnoff (up inside bridge between roads) FACING
Near Ballarat Rd turnoff (behind sign) GOING
Near Boundary Rd turnoff after twin Shells (behind sign) GOING


As for the Westgate (Most likely incomplete as i dont use it as often);
to city;
Bridge just after WRRd entrance ('special' camera, hard to spot) GOING
½ way up westgate bridge

from city;
½ way up westgate bridge
Power substation on leftside, near exit to altona (behind sign, can see camera box between signs 1/3 from left) GOING *Not 100% sure of exact location but its there somewhere

I also don't trust any of the Citylink toll collection points either.


This is done off the top of my head, may have missed one but this list is for curiosity purposes only.

[pred8r]

something else occured to me, with the speeds on the westgate and WRR being variable, how can they tell where you are in relation to whichever speed sign. Meaning if you happen to pass through all the speed signs just before they drop, will get get busted at the other end? (Id give a clearer description of what i mean but it would take WAY too long.)

I have seen the speedlimit sign drop by 20km/h between the car in front and myself.

Also, How many people have found thier car will roll faster down the hill under Cruise Control?
They are quite good at maintaining speeds going uphill, but if there was enough downs or a particularly steep/speedy one (eg. Westgate bridge, or WRR near Pascoe Vale Rd) you may well get pinged as your average speed went over the 3% allowance. Have fun suing the vehicle manufacturer for that one.

Ive also noticed on SOME uphills my cruise will put me WAY over the limit as i crest the hill, I attribute this to the sampling rate of the unit to be far too low/outdated. I will now need to keep much more of an eye on my speedo (than on my surroundings because speeding will cost me $$$ but an accident gets me a new vehicle. ****this last paragraph is an attempt at humor and NOT an admission of stupidity****)

[stevedee3]

Victorian fixed camera locations (http://www.justice.vic.gov.au/CA256E5F0003DEF3/page/Speed+Cameras-About+Speed+Cameras?OpenDocument&1=10-Speed+Cameras%7E&2=30-About+Speed+Cameras%7E&3=%7E)

[pred8r]

Victorian fixed camera locations (http://www.justice.vic.gov.au/CA256E5F0003DEF3/page/Speed+Cameras-About+Speed+Cameras?OpenDocument&1=10-Speed+Cameras%7E&2=30-About+Speed+Cameras%7E&3=%7E)

This
http://www.justice.vic.gov.au/CA256902000FE154/Lookup/Road_Safety_PDFs/$file/Mobile_Cameras_Policy_Manual060424.pdf
is an interesting read particularly about placement of cameras re: hills

[daaaaavek]

I had an instance once where I was passing quite a few slower vehicles over about 30mins or so and had a XR6 Falcon following me through, then when the XR6 decided to overtake me it turned out ot be an unmarked police car.

I was driving up the Hume Highway and was following a police car doing 130 km/h .. for about 300kms. I sat behind him by 200-300 metres and would overtake the same cars all the way. Then he sped off which is when I decided to stop following. Turn out he pulled in at the next service station and when we crossed paths he just nodded and kept going. I have a lot of respect for Police and what they are forced to do - they aren't the bad guys. They are enforcing the laws passed by our mediocre Govt.

[auzvectra]

i know exactly what u mean, but quite a few of them up here enjoy thier job a lil too much.
mind you there is plenty of idiots on the road that make it harder for the rest of us :(.
i have seen plenty of them, make you realise why the cops are so harsh to us, they act on the majority due to the minority.

[platypus]

you know what....


thats how they used to get you for speeding in the old days before radars!!

[pred8r]

you know what....


thats how they used to get you for speeding in the old days before radars!!

They used, and on very rare occasions still do use, Amphometers AKA Licorice strips/straps.

[platypus]

They used, and on very rare occasions still do use, Amphometers AKA Licorice strips/straps.
not too often - still i remember a friend used to think thats what every RTA survey strip was there for... to nab you!!

[NXA-16H]

They used, and on very rare occasions still do use, Amphometers AKA Licorice strips/straps.

Well I have no idea how fixed speed cameras work, short of actually using an amphometer as you mentioned.

Certainly I can tell you guys right now that a fixed speed camera on the Great Western Highway at Valley Heights does indeed use an amphometer system. You can not only feel the "whump-whump" of the liquorice straps as you drive over them, but also see their glossy surface as you approach, in contrast to the matt-black of the tarmac. Even at night.

Now I'm sure that if NSW doesn't have these "Point-to-Point" cameras, we'll certainly have them in the near future.

I think the most likely spots the RTA will place them is as follows:

1. M4 between Cumberland Highway Overpass @ Wentworthville and the M7 Light Horse Interchange @ Eastern Creek.

2. Actually on the M7 at various points.

3. Princes Highway between Sutherland and Heathcote.

I doubt there will be any up in the Blue Mountains. The Highway patrols up here are too active, and consequently too much in motorists' minds to warrant their installation. Still, we'll wait and see.

Perhaps the best way of staying on guard is to get a TomTom with up-to-date software on speed camera locations and school zones.

I might just invest in one.

NXA-16H

[platypus]

3. Princes Highway between Sutherland and Heathcote.there's one there already, just not active in a fine sense - needs to pass through parliament to be used still!!

amphometers are only used for survey purposes nowadays, as they are very easy to contest, fixed speed cameras are still radar technology, where a ping is emmitted, and the returned signal is altered depending on the speed of the object (this is a very basic explanation)